Re: Asking for the ban of Frans Pop from debian-vote ... (Was: [AMENDMENT]: Release Etch now, with source-less but legal and freely licensed firmware)
On Thu, Oct 05, 2006 at 08:55:50PM +0200, Luk Claes wrote:
> Sven Luther wrote:
> > On Thu, Oct 05, 2006 at 06:45:05PM +0200, Luk Claes wrote:
> >> Sven Luther wrote:
> >>> Hi list masters and DPL,
> >> Hi Sven
> >>> Since it seems Frans is not able to leave ad-hominem attacks out of this
> >>> discussion, and given the precedent of my ban from -release on similar issues,
> >>> i now officially ask for Frans Pop to be banned from debian-vote, until such a
> >>> time as he is able to discuss issues, without being able to resort to
> >>> ad-hominem and defaming attacks like he has done here, even if in a slightly
> >>> disguised form.
> >>> Mails like his don't help the issue to be solved, bring absolutely nothing,
> >>> and are borderline insulting, and nobody want to go into another repeat of
> >>> what happened last spring.
> >> Communication is always between two or more ends...
> > Maybe, but then i don't see what such conversation brings if one party is
> > acting in evident bad faith, and whose whole purpose is to hurt me and
> > continnue making me the scapegoat in order to make my opinion count less.
> Please, stop this whining it doesn't bring you anything. I don't believe Frans
> is acting in bad faith, though he might still not trust you or even like you,
> but that's something totally different...
What do i care if he thrusts me, he is difaming me in public, and making
degrading comments against me.
> >> As Frans is not interested in participating in the discussion anymore, I don't
> >> see what a ban would bring if it would be justified to ban him in the first
> >> place...
> > He says that, but he will again try to attack me in such a way, he has been
> > doing so repeteadly over these last month, altough always in insidious and
> > hidden ways.
> I don't believe he will try to attack you, though he might be cautious and you
> may be felt as attacked because of that...
He has done so twice already since i was banned from debian-release.
> >> The reason why you were banned from debian-release was mostly because of
> >> turning it in a discussion list which it is not intended for. The tone of the
> > Because Frans ad-hominem attacked me in the first place (dismissing my opinion
> > in the subject of module .udebs, and accusing me of having an hidden agenda).
> > But then nobody saw anything wrong in that.
> Most people just want to work together, not reply to whining... Your
> accusations might be correct, though it doesn't bring you or the project
> anything if you keep repeating them...
Yes, except i am the perfect scapegoat half the project is dead set on to
bash at the minor occasion, i am seriously sick of this, it is as if people
are trying to drive me out. So, Frans can keep on insulting me and making
insidious derogative comments, and everyone finds it just fine, while i get
attacks on irc when i post perfectly reasonable stuff and try to have a
Also, half the folk in this threads are repeating all the same things all
> >> messages was something that made it clear that you were not going to stop
> >> sending such mails to the list...
> > And the tone of Frans message makes it clear that he will not stop sending
> > such mails to the list, maybe not in the immediate future
> I wouldn't count on that, people differ quite a bit...
Well, it has been a constant since around fall last year, so i have lost hope
of it ever changing.
> >> PS: Sending Cc's to debian-release in the middle of a discussion is not very
> >> clever when you just get unbanned...
> > How was i to know i was unbanned ?
> > Also, you have to be aware that Andreas Barth complained i didn't send
> > information to the debian-release list concerning the new proposals, so what
> > am i to do ?
> Andreas Barth asking you to send something to debian-release could be seen at
> least as a sign of being unbanned...
How would i know, vorlon told me weeks ago that he was going to ask for my
unbanning, and when i asked you, i was told this was not the case, and i had
no news since then.
> You could send a notice about the proposals and maybe asking to join the
> discussion on debian-vote, but certainly not sending a Cc to debian-release in
> the middle of a discussion.
Are you sure i did that ? i don't remember CCing stuff in the middle of a
thread, only sent there new threads, believing it will be blocked by the ban
Not cheerfulness at all on my part.