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Re: Re-Proposal - preserve freedom of choice of init systems

On 16 October 2014 23:26, Paul Tagliamonte <paultag@debian.org> wrote:
> On Thu, Oct 16, 2014 at 11:20:13PM +0300, Aigars Mahinovs wrote:
>> According to my reading of the proposal - either logind gets an RC bug
>> for not being able to work with other init systems
> To be clear, this would be a bug against src:systemd about it not
> working with non-systemd. Do we expect the systemd maintainers to fix
> this?

To be frank, in cases like logind I would expect the logind binary
package to be split out and its source patched in such a way to allow
it to work without systemd running (however badly) and moving the main
systemd package from Dependencies to Recommended.

This would be no different if, for example, some upstream decided that
they need to copy some common library, modify it and statically
compile that modified version into their software - we would expect
the maintainer to either convince upstream not to do that or to make
and maintain a patch that would make the software work with the system
shared version of the library. The proposal does explicitly allow for
the software to have degraded functionality if an unsupported init
system is used, so such shim is a valid option.

> I don't think it's unfair that things don't work in Docker if they need some userland stuff that isn't around.

Well, if you want it around, you should be able to start it inside
that container (or a chroot), without having to start up an init
system there. And ideally have a way of connecting to that userland
stuff running in host or other container by simply sharing some socket
(file or network).

Having such policy clearly stated should also motivate upstreams to
consider what would and should happen when another init system is used
when designing new software features, so that our maintainers (or
users) don't actually have to face this issue too often.
Best regards,
    Aigars Mahinovs        mailto:aigarius@debian.org
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