Re: Jessie upgrade without systemd [was: Debian *not very good]
On Sat, 26 Nov 2016 09:01:33 -0500
Henning Follmann <hfollmann@itcfollmann.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 10:27:07AM +0000, Joe wrote:
> > On Sat, 26 Nov 2016 10:02:50 +0100
> > <tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:
> >
> > > On Fri, Nov 25, 2016 at 03:57:53PM -0800, Patrick Bartek wrote:
> >
> > > >
> > > > If you do a normal dist-upgrade Wheezy to Jessie, sysvinit will
> > > > be replaced with systemd.
> > >
> > > Not forcefully.
> > >
> > > > And probably screw everything up..
> > >
> > > Now this is an unnecessarily loaded statement. Given the smoking
> > > holes the last flame war has left[1], I'd tread carefully if I
> > > were you ;-)
> >
> > A fair number of wheezy systems will be servers, upgraded many
> > times. Mine started out as sarge. What are the odds of such a
> > system making the change to systemd without problems?
> >
>
> A reasonable amount.
> I did it, and experienced no issues at all. In fact I had more issues
> while upgrading to wheezy.
Good to hear. Yes, upgrades have been getting progressively less easy.
>
> > I converted a sid to systemd, but had to give up on it as it became
> > too flaky, unstable in all senses of the word. A workstation isn't
> > really a problem to reinstall from scratch, an old server is a
> > nightmare.
> >
> > Obviously I had to do a reinstallation to move to 64 bits, but that
> > was a get-selections/set-selections job, with the old /etc pretty
> > much copied over. All the same software, just 64 bit, and more
> > importantly, all the old scripts. That's not going to work with a
> > systemd-based reinstall.
>
> You hardly can blame systemd for a 32/64 bit switch.
> so you exchange binaries, and? Not s systemd issue.
Sorry, I may not have been clear, I was saying that reinstalling to
jump the 32/64 bit barrier has been the only significant upheaval in
the progress of my server since sarge, and that reinstallation was like
for like and therefore quite simple.
If I have to reinstall the server with systemd from the beginning,
because the upgrade is too difficult, then restoring its current
functionality is likely to be significantly harder than the 32/64 bit
change was. I will be migrating configurations between different Debian
versions manually, at the same time as dealing with any systemd issues.
I hope very much to avoid the need for that.
>
> And while we are at a network issue topic (OP).
> Systemd is actually better than any network-manager or your beloved
> init scripts at that. It tracks much more reliably the status of your
> interfaces than any other method. Period.
>
Good, although I have had no trouble with networking so far, and have
never installed network-manager on this machine. It has two permanent
Ethernet ports and no other interfaces than lo and an openvpn server.
--
Joe
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