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Re: OT: The following packages will be REMOVED:

On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 1:41 PM, Ralf Mardorf
<ralf.mardorf@alice-dsl.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 13:30 -0500, Tom H wrote:
>> On Wed, Nov 14, 2012 at 5:45 AM, Ralf Mardorf
>> <ralf.mardorf@alice-dsl.net> wrote:

>>> I guess the averaged Ubuntu user isn't aware that Ubuntu switched from
>>> init to upstart, the averaged Arch user is aware of the switch from
>>> initscripts to systemd. I wonder if it was possible to Upgrade from
>>> Ubuntu old school to Ubuntu upstart? I think so, because Ubuntu e.g.
>>> still maintains policykit, udev. Arch doesn't!
>> You must mean consolekit not policykit.
>> You're underestimating Ubuntu users. For example, NetworkManager's
>> startup has been migrated to upstart so
>> [initctl] restart network-manager
>> and
>> service network-manager restart
>> work and
>> invoke-rc.d network-manager restart
>> and
>> /etc/init.d/network-manager
>> don't work.
>> So, at the very least, anyone using Ubuntu who's had to restart a
>> service that's been migrated to upstart knows that something's
>> changed.

> No, I'm talking about the kit family and especially about PolicyKit
> https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/PolicyKit .
> And if for Debian udev, PolicyKit etc. still should be available as an
> independent package, then because Debian maintainers extract it from
> systemd, "In April 2012, udev's source tree was merged into systemd" -
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Udev

Please don't confise the "*kits"; policykit's independent of systemd
whereas consolekit has been deprecated by systemd-logind (and I assume
that distributions that aren't defaulting to systemd are continuing to
work on it; hopefully jointly).

Systemd hasn't gobbled up policykit yet, but hope springs eternal! :)

The big recent change in policykit is the move to javascript rules
rather than xml or ini-style ones.

> There are still howtos for Ubuntu, that refer to "/etc/init.d/foo start|
> stop|status" instead of "service".

Whether it's clear in those howtos or not, they apply to daemons that
haven't been migrated to upstart, two that come to mind immediately
are apache2 and nginx.

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