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Re: The following packages will be REMOVED:

Le 14.11.2012 10:27, Ralf Mardorf a écrit :
On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 10:11 +0100, Jochen Spieker wrote:
Ralf Mardorf:
> On Wed, 2012-11-14 at 08:23 +0000, Jon Dowland wrote:
>> I suspect what is happening is the transition from ia32-libs to multiarch, and >> the non-free 3rd party packages have not been updated to work with the multiarch
>> way of doing things.
> The disadvantage of upgrading from one release to the next release and
> the disadvantage of rolling releases.

This has more to do with the disadvantage of non-free software or
external repositories in general.

> I can't speak for this particular case, but sometimes it seems to be
> less work to make a new install.

… which won't help in this case.

If it's a transition issue, why wouldn't help a install of the release version the OP wants, instead of upgrading from another release version?

It doesn't matter what exactly the culprit is, installing the new
release instead of upgrading from the forerunner will avoid conflicts
caused by another style, policy or what ever.

> Btw. the reason for me that perhaps will make me switch from Arch back
> to Debian.

Oh, please. You don't understand this particular problem but use it as a
reason for a switch anyway?  I generelly don't understand why people
feel the need to announce their switch on this list

This switch has nothing to do with this particular issue, but with
transitions. I'm thinking of not upgrading from one distro release to
another and of not using a rolling release anymore. I'm still uncertain, but I experienced at least the rolling release model as not working and
I often read about issues when other people upgrade from one distro
release to another.


I do not know for other distros, but I tried to install arch once. I ran into a dependency problem which avoided me to install an Xserver, nothing less, nothing more. I quickly leave the idea of using it after that.

But it does not mean that rolling release system is bad, only that arch guys plays with packages without always being sure that will break nothing. Oh, sure, packages are probably more recent than debian's one. But you can not be sure things works (even on a fresh install ^^).

On the other hand, I am using debian testing/unstable depending on my wishes since 2 years. I can assure you that broken packages only happen very rarely (and never on testing, which is just the next stable and so is tested enough for my needs). And this gave the potential advantages and disadvantages of more recent softwares. I just recommend my friends to use debian testing for their desktop/laptops. For servers, obviously, only stable is suitable, maybe with some apt-pinning if you *really* need a more recent package.

My opinion is that Debian offer a very nice of doing things for releases: _ one stable release, like the one you can find in proprietary software world, with a consequence of stability, ease of use, and you know that there will be no features added or removed which mess-up your system. Except if you install it, of course. _ a testing rolling release, reliable enough for simple users in my opinion. You will have more recent stuff, which means you can see features appear or disappear, but it will not (at least, I have not seen that) have broken dependencies. _ an unstable rolling release, for people who do not mind broken dependencies and/or softwares. It does not happen very often, though, because there is also the experimental "area" where things are tried before. But experimental is not usable alone, unlike unstable or testing.

Conclusion: even with debian, you can have a rolling release. But you can avoid it as well if you search stability. Conclusion 2: with debian, you can have removed packages from a stable release to another. But it does not mean that you will break things. It is possible, of course, but I am not sure about the word often. When I was starting with Debian, I was used to install the stable and upgrade it to testing, and I can not remember any issue.

PS: yes, I install debian regularly... Because I love to play with highly critical files like init scripts or boot loaders. This is my way to understand how things works: tinker to learn , and if you break things, try to repair :D

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