Re: Request for English debconf template review
[Please respect M-F-T on replies, I'm not subscribed to this list.]
On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 02:37:28PM +0100, MJ Ray wrote:
> Steve Langasek <vorlon@debian.org> wrote:
> > Does anyone see a way that these templates could be further shortened
> > without losing key information? Or anything that should otherwise be
> > improved here?
> Here's my attempt. Hope I didn't declare too much as "non-key".
> I also saved a bit of space by removing a redundant "modules" then
> lost it again by expanding PAM on first use...
> --- libpam0g.templates.orig 2007-08-29 14:20:06.000000000 +0100
> +++ libpam0g.templates 2007-08-29 14:31:04.000000000 +0100
> @@ -1,20 +1,20 @@
> Template: libpam0g/restart-services
> Type: string
> _Description: Services to restart for PAM library upgrade:
> - Most PAM-using services that are running at the time of upgrade must be
> - restarted before they can use PAM modules built against this new version
> - of libpam.
> + Most services that use Pluggable Authentication Modules (PAM) need to
> + be restarted to use modules built for this new version of libpam.
Thanks, much better than mine. I would probably even reduce it to:
+ Most services that use Pluggable Authentication Modules need to
+ be restarted to use modules built for this new version of libpam.
If the user doesn't figure out that Pluggable Authentication Modules == PAM,
I don't see any reason to waste the space explaining it. :)
> - Please check the following list of services detected for restart and
> - correct it if needed. The services are listed by the names of the init
> - scripts in /etc/init.d and must be separated by spaces. To avoid
> - restarting any services at this time, use an empty list.
> + The following list of services were detected as running now and
> + needing a restart. Please check it and correct if needed. Services
> + are listed as init.d script names and must be separated by spaces.
> + To avoid restarting any services at this time, empty the list.
Hmm, inaccurate; we do no checking of whether the services are running, we
are only detecting whether the services are installed and we use invoke-rc.d
to handle the rest.
Also not significantly shorter than the original, so I think I would retain
my version here.
But perhaps:
Please check the following list of init.d scripts for services to restart,
and correct it if needed. The script names must be separated by spaces.
To avoid restarting any services at this time, use an empty list.
?
BTW, "empty the list" is misleading with the debconf readline frontend,
which in some cases presents the user with a prompt and requires them to
copy the "default" text into the prompt... I'd like to avoid any language
that's tied to a particular user interface.
> - Among the services that require restarting are the display managers kdm,
> - wdm, and xdm. If you are upgrading from within an X session started with
> + Display managers kdm, wdm and xdm may require restarting.
> + If you are upgrading from within an X session started with
> one of these display managers, restarting that service will terminate your
> - X session. It is recommended that you remove this service from the
> - list here and restart it later at your convenience.
> + X session. It is recommended that you remove that service from this
> + list and restart it manually at a more convenient time.
> .
> Other services that use PAM but cannot be restarted for you include
> xscreensaver, gnome-screensaver, and xlockmore. You will not be able to
Stylistically, I prefer my original again. :) But thanks for the
suggestions.
On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 03:25:49PM +0100, Justin B Rye wrote:
> I've only got a couple of suggested further tweaks:
> > --- libpam0g.templates.orig 2007-08-29 14:20:06.000000000 +0100
> > +++ libpam0g.templates 2007-08-29 14:31:04.000000000 +0100
> ...
> > - Most PAM-using services that are running at the time of upgrade must be
> > - restarted before they can use PAM modules built against this new version
> > - of libpam.
> > + Most services that use Pluggable Authentication Modules (PAM) need to
> > + be restarted to use modules built for this new version of libpam.
> (Is that "Most" strictly necessary? What are the exceptions?)
One notable exception is ssh. I haven't looked for others, but ssh is
definitely not being restarted here since it doesn't need to be. In
general, any PAM-using service that only loads libpam after forking to
handle a particular user request, or that re-execs itself dynamically, would
not need a restart.
> I notice that here and in the original there's some inconsistency in
> inter-sentence spacing.
<sigh> I fear debconf-updatepo rewrapping lines for me may ultimately get
the credit for that... thanks, fixed to a consistent two spaces.
On Wed, Aug 29, 2007 at 10:00:06PM +0200, Christian Perrier wrote:
> Too long debconf templates raise a few concerns for me:
> - being long, they're likely to not be read entirely...:)
> - they are likely to be split on two screens on 80x25 terminals
> - their translations are even more likely to be too long for such terminals
Well, yes; hence my request for help in shortening them. :)
> > restarted before they can use PAM modules built against this new version
> > of libpam.
> "they can use the new PAM modules" could be enough.....
Except that it doesn't refer to a specific set of new PAM modules, it refers
to any PAM modules that have been built to use the new libpam interfaces.
Many of these will be out-of-tree modules with version numbers that are
unrelated to libpam0g.
I'd rather not shorten the templates by changing them to say things that
aren't true. :)
> > .
> > Please check the following list of services detected for restart and
> > correct it if needed. The services are listed by the names of the init
> > scripts in /etc/init.d and must be separated by spaces. To avoid
> > restarting any services at this time, use an empty list.
> "space-separated list of services (named after their init script)"
> I'd drop the sentence about an empty string not restarting anything:
> that should be obvious to anyone.
Thanks, I've incorporated these changes with some slight modifications.
> > .
> > Among the services that require restarting are the display managers kdm,
> > wdm, and xdm. If you are upgrading from within an X session started with
> > one of these display managers, restarting that service will terminate your
> > X session. It is recommended that you remove this service from the
> > list here and restart it later at your convenience.
> > .
> > Other services that use PAM but cannot be restarted for you include
> > xscreensaver, gnome-screensaver, and xlockmore. You will not be able to
> > authenticate to these services until you restart them manually.
> Maybe something like "Some other services such as ...... cannot be
> restarted automatically and will nee you to restart them manually"
Thanks, changed.
An updated version of the templates is attached. Any further suggestions?
Cheers,
--
Steve Langasek Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer to set it on, and I can move the world.
vorlon@debian.org http://www.debian.org/
Template: libpam0g/restart-services
Type: string
_Description: Services to restart for PAM library upgrade:
Most services that use Pluggable Authentication Modules need to be
restarted to use modules built for this new version of libpam. Please
review the following space-separated list of init.d scripts for services
to be restarted, and correct it if needed.
.
Among the services that require restarting are the display managers kdm,
wdm, and xdm. If you are upgrading from within an X session started with
one of these display managers, restarting that service will terminate your
X session. It is recommended that you remove this service from the
list here and restart it later at your convenience.
.
Some other services such as xscreensaver, gnome-screensaver, and xlockmore
cannot be restarted for you. You will not be able to authenticate to these
services until you restart them manually.
Template: libpam0g/restart-failed
Type: error
#flag:translate!:3
_Description: Failure restarting some services for PAM upgrade
The following services could not be restarted for the PAM library upgrade:
.
${services}
.
You will need to start these manually by running
'/etc/init.d/<service> start'.
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