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Re: jquery debate with upstream

On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 11:24:19AM +0800, Paul Wise wrote:
> On Sat, Mar 15, 2014 at 11:02 AM, Steve Langasek wrote:

> > That was a conscious decision on the part of the project to revise the text
> > of the Social Contract.  That vote did *not* replace the use of the word
> > "program" in DFSG#2 with the word "software".  It is incorrect to infer from
> > this vote that Debian decided to require source for all non-program works.

> As far as I can tell, not modifying the DSFG at the same time was an
> oversight. Fixing that mistake was attempted in a later GR but that
> was blocked with a narrow margin.

> https://www.debian.org/vote/2006/vote_004

I agree that it was an oversight to leave these ambiguities in the DFSG at
the time it was being amended.  I do not agree with your implied assumption
that an attempt to remove these ambiguities would have resulted in us
deciding to apply DFSG#2 to non-program works.  I would have voted against
that then and would vote against it now.

I was also among the majority who voted against the above GR, and that GR
didn't even go as far as you are proposing.  That it was blocked "by a
narrow margin" gives you no more moral authority than if it were defeated in
a landslide; the Debian project did not ratify this interpretation of the
DFSG, and it is inappropriate for anyone to make source a de facto
requirement for main by changing the facts on the ground.

We all agree that it is best to have source available for everything we ship
in main, including non-programs.  But there's a big difference between
agreeing that it's a best practice, and kicking it out of main for not
complying with this best-practice guideline.

> The DFSG mentions "program" in other sections too. Does that mean that
> we can accept non-programs with licenses that:

> Discriminate against fields of endeavour (item 6)?

> Don't let Debian pass licenses on to users (item 7)?

> Don't apply to entities other than Debian (item 8)?

> I definitely can't agree with your interpretation here and think we
> should amend the DFSG to replace all uses of the words "software" or
> "program" with "work" or similar.

It's fine for you to hold the position that we should amend it in this way.
It's not fine to demand that Debian behave as if this amendment *had already
been made*, because this is *not* the meaning the document had either at the
time it was adopted or at the time it was amended.

Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer                                    http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com                                     vorlon@debian.org

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