Re: upstart: please update to latest upstream version
* Russ Allbery <rra@debian.org> [120224 19:28]:
> Staring at the bug and the makefile and thinking hard is usually sufficient.
It's usually sufficient (because the concept is quite easy), but once
that does not work there is hardly any other chance, except wild
experimenting (which I hardly would like to do with by boot system).
I've yet to see a case where -d actually helps.
> One of the primary features of newer init systems like upstart and systemd
> is that they take care of the routine stuff automatically and thereby
> reduce the conceptual surface of your init script equivalent. Simpler
> things are inherently easier to debug; there are fewer variables.
It's just a much more complicated setup. Daemons like to all have their
special little quirks. And starting or shutting down a system tends to
belong to the most ugly things to debug. Also note that quite some
functionality will be some C code especially the early and very late
code, I guess, where debugability is the hardest.
> Yes,
> the underlying infrastructure has to not be buggy, just like make has to
> not be buggy, but now you're talking about debugging systemd or make, not
> your init script, and you now have the benefit of lots of eyes.
So software will ever be without bugs. The question is not: Will it have
bugs? The question is: What effects will bugs have?
Bernhard R. Link
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