RE: Installing Cinnamon 2.0
> On Sat, 2013-10-12 at 01:43 -0500, Mark Allums wrote:
> > > >> Not really, you at least need to manually add a link, regarding
> > > >> to the different program names.
> > > >
> > > > I never did, and never had to. It works fine.
> > >
> > > Just because you're using software that doesn't use this software
> > > as dependency.
> >
> > I don't know what you are talking about.
>
> Read the mails or rephrase your question. I don't understand your
> question. It's about another conflict that does need a workaround _for
> Debian/Ubuntu too_.
No, it doesn't. Give up, you are wrong about this.
> [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ ls -l /usr/bin/matedialog
> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 6 Aug 18 18:06 /usr/bin/matedialog -> zenity
>
> Some software for Mate does launch matedialog and some software for
> GNOME (or other GTK based DEs) does use zenity. IOW you not only need
> the above link, but also a dummy package.
>
> [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ sudo ntpdate ntp.favey.ch && sudo pacman -S
> mate-dialogs
> 12 Oct 09:58:25 ntpdate[2931]: adjust time server 195.34.89.227 offset
> 0.007741 sec
> warning: downgrading package mate-dialogs (2013.08.18-1 => 1.6.0-2)
> resolving dependencies...
> looking for inter-conflicts...
> :: mate-dialogs and zenity are in conflict. Remove zenity? [y/N]
Mate-dialogs does *not* conflict with zenity, when using the Debian package packaged by upstream. I don't know where you are getting this, but it's wrong.
>
> And again and again and again, it's an issue caused by upstream, not by
> Arch Linux, the situation for Debian/Ubuntu is the same! There might be
> package maintainers who maintain some Mate packages for Debian not
> following upstream, this could solve some issues, but not those similar
> to the matedialog issue.
>
> On Sat, 2013-10-12 at 02:20 -0500, Mark Allums wrote:
> > > https://github.com/mate-desktop/archlinux-packages
> >
> > >From the linked page: mate-file-archiver: Removed any packages from
> > the 'depends' that are pulled in via gtk2. 24 days ago
> >
> > Looks to me like they fixed the conflict in Arch. You have no leg to
> > stand on with this one. Also, that's Arch. The Debian version does
> > not have this problem.
>
> No, it's not an official Arch repository and the dependencies are from
> upstream, should I repeat this again and again?
> [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ sudo ntpdate ntp.favey.ch && sudo pacman -S
> mate-file-archiver
> 12 Oct 09:41:45 ntpdate[2868]: adjust time server 195.34.89.227 offset -
> 0.439659 sec
> resolving dependencies...
> looking for inter-conflicts...
> :: mate-file-archiver and file-roller are in conflict. Remove file-roller? [y/N]
>
> On Sat, 2013-10-12 at 02:21 -0500, Mark Allums wrote:
> > > https://github.com/mate-desktop/debian-packages
> > > -->
> > > https://github.com/mate-desktop/debian-packages/tree/master/mate-
> file-archiver
*****************************************************
* *
* These are irrelevant. mate-file-archiver does not exist *
* anymore, and engrampa is optional. *
* *
*****************************************************
> Github is obsolete? Can you post up-to-date links to upstream?
>
> [rocketmouse@archlinux ~]$ sudo ntpdate ntp.favey.ch && sudo pacman -S
> mate-file-archiver
> 12 Oct 10:04:31 ntpdate[2945]: adjust time server 195.34.89.227 offset -
> 0.005115 sec
> resolving dependencies...
> looking for inter-conflicts...
> :: mate-file-archiver and file-roller are in conflict. Remove
> file-roller? [y/N]
Stop using Arch for examples. We are not talking about Arch. We are talking about the Debian Package made by upstream themselves.
>
> However, even if some things should be solved by packages for what ever
> distro, then there are maintainers who do a lot of work, to ensure that
> the packages can be installed, whatever packages else are installed and
> they need to take care that this doesn't change with an update. People
> started to drop GNOME 3 and to search for a GNOME replacement, because
> it was GNOME's policy to do similar insane things. I chose old Debian
> stable, because they didn't make pulseaudio a hard dependency for GNOME
> 2. It was somebody like you Mark, who informed me about this, but he was
> mistaken. When I needed to upgrade old stable, right after installing
> it, because it was too outdated, pulseaudio became a hard dependency.
>
> IOW even GNOME, where upstream fulfills basic rules regarding to
> dependencies (conflicts) does cause issues, even by Debian packages.
>
> However, the subject is "Installing Cinnamon 2.0" and not Mate.
The subject is also alternatives to Cinnamon (and Gnome 3). Perhaps someone should change the subject line.
Ralf, every one of your objections to MATE have been refuted. Come up with some new objections, and we'll discuss those. Otherwise, try and keep in mind that you are not the only person on the planet. Other people have other needs and wants. Your problems are not their problems. Don't try and make the decision for me. I am quite capable of making my own decisions.
Besides, just because those issues that used to exist did exist doesn't mean that they haven't been addressed, or won't eventually be addressed. MATE is a small team and they are working hard. MATE is quite usable now, and I look forward to future versions.
If you don't want to use it, that's fine, don't. It's purely optional. But don't disparage others who use it. That's just bigoted.
Mark
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