Re: is it possible to install a desktop-manager without python and perl?
On Jun 24, 2009, at 1:21 AM, Cowley Harris wrote:
This guy asked a relatively simple question which I'm paraphrasing
here as "can you run Debian without perl or python", the answer is
pretty much no.
He gave his reasons for the question and his opinion on the answers he
was given. He's also started probably the most interesting thread on
this list for a while.
I think the interest has come from people responding to him, not from
anything he's said.
As I've read it, he's not attacked anyone personally even when
disagreeing with people and yet he is being personally attacked for
his opinions.
Well, here is my opinion, if you feel threatened enough by someone who
disagrees with you, that you must insult them, it's a sign of a weak
logic or a weak mind. It's the reaction typical of a zealot, fool or
troll and not the response of someone with some useful knowledge to
share.
I don't see anyone being threatened by him or acting like they're
threatened. I know I've stated my thoughts on this as I've seen some
patterns emerge, such as his statements getting more and more extreme
and as many of them show more and more of a claim to knowing something
it's clear he does not know. But I haven't seen anyone insult him yet
-- but then I haven't read many of the overnight posts yet.
I don't agree with him that a "one programming language system"
would be "the right way to do things" or that it would lead to a
bright future of our free software world". but I'm not going to insult
him for his belief. In fact it might be a good thing that he tries
this endeavor.
“Reasonable people adapt themselves to the world. Unreasonable people
attempt to adapt the world to themselves. All progress, therefore,
depends on unreasonable people.” GB Shaw.
Yes, that's a cute quotation. I can also cite Zen quotations or other
sources about the wisdom of knowing when to fight and when not to, or
when to push a big rock out of the way or when it's better to walk
around that rock.
The benefits of multiple languages over a 1 language system (1LS) is
that it gives you the ability to program at the appropriate level of
the problem space. The studies show that the higher level you program
the more instructions you have per line, and yet the bugs per line
stay about the same.
The studies also show that the amount of LOC produced by programmers
of the same skill level is about the same, whether they use assembly,
c or java, and yet the amount of instructions per LOC increase with
level of the language. More productivity in the same time span is a
major advantage.
Definitely. There are definite advantages to a higher level language
and we are well past the days when we gained any significant advantage
by having a programmer write in Assembler to save memory space and CPU
time instead of having the same system done in a higher level
language, whether it's an interpreted one or compiled one.
On a personal note, I think that programmers that use different
languages can communicate in "meta-programming" terms, a hash-table is
a hash-table whether you call it a hash or a dictionary. The benefits
of a 1LS would be small in comparison to the benefits of plural
system.
Which is what pretty much everyone but the OP has said. I think we
all agree on that. I've found times where I may be talking with
someone who knows one language but does not know the one I'm working
in that I'm using a modified hash table or I'll say, "It's something
like a hash table, but it's my own class, so there's some extra
functions." That generally does well enough. I've never had a
problem talking with another programmer who is not familiar with the
language I'm using where I couldn't communicate what I was doing easily.
Hal
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