RE: Open Source Supported Graphics Cards
On Monday, August 14, 2006 11:52 AM -0500, Albert Dengg wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 12, 2006 at 02:07:43AM -0500, Seth Goodman wrote:
> > On Friday, August 11, 2006 10:39 PM -0500, Anthony M Simonelli
> > wrote:
> >
<...>
> > > You can get books that help. In fact, the Debian GNU/Linux 3.1
> > > Bible (ISBN 0-7645-7644-5) is a great book for those just
> > > getting started with Debian and Linux and answers the first two
> > > common tasks they'd need to know as well as installation help
> > > and getting a desktop up and running. They also discuss
> > > Internet and Intranet services such as web servers, printing,
> > > file servers, FTP, etc, and it's only $40.00 (hey, you're not
> > > paying for the operating system!)
> >
> > I don't need books like that because I can read the
> > documentation. The average Windows user is not going to read it.
> > They don't need to read books to fire up their Windows boxen, and
> > they don't expect to read books to move to Linux. If it were up
> > to snuff, they wouldn't need to. You're preaching to the choir by
> > telling me that a technically adept person can make Debian do most
> > common tasks without inordinate difficulty. The average computer
> > user, OTOH, is a completely different story.
>
> well, the average windows install done by an average user does not
> really work as it should, give all the security problems and worm
> distribution, which is at least partly due to the fact that with
> windows, everybody thinks they can do it themselves and know what
> they are doing.
At least they can do it, whether we approve of the results of not.
That's not the case for Debian. If you have to hire a sysadmin to
install and maintain the system, it is hardly free. Sure, it works well
for any institution large enough to have an IT staff. Everyone else is
effectively excluded unless they are willing and able to become computer
jocks rather than doing their actual jobs. I really think we're
unnecessarily excluding the largest group of people who could benefit
from free, open-source software. I don't think we want to be saying
that computers should only be used by those with access to competent IT
staff. If that's the club's charter, I'm not a member.
> ...
>
> my point is, there are different distros with different goals
> and also i have 2 "normal users" here using debian without any
> problems (both don't know pcs worth a damn and would also have
> problems with windows)...i do the system administration and for
> them it just works (and for me it is less work them administrating
> a xp home install which does not have fs permissions where i have
> to reconstruct all sort of system files they alter/delete be
> accident... :-) )
You are the sysadmin for these two Windows-type users, which is the only
environment in which they can realistically use Debian. Take away the
sysadmin or Linux mentor and the chances of them being able to configure
a system that is as useful to them as their Windows boxes are slim to
none.
Your example makes my point quite well. Unsophisticated users
attempting to use Debian need an experienced user or sysadmin to show
them how to do anything that is not quickly accessible through a GUI.
Unsophisticated users can and do successfully configure and use Windows
(and Mac) boxes every day without the benefits of sysadmins. They can't
do a domain controller, LDAP or a mail server, but they can construct a
functioning peer-to-peer network, share printers, access the internet
and get their email. The fact that the resulting system is insecure is
due to the horrific quality of the underlying operating system
implementation, not the fact that there are sufficiently simple wizards
and GUI's to allow them to configure their own systems.
--
Seth Goodman
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