Re: Where is Debian going?
On Fri, 12 Jul 2002 08:35:20 -0700
Mike Egglestone <megglestone@heritage.sd57.bc.ca> wrote:
> make it really quite easy. X is easy to install, setting up the nics,
> etc etc. For a linux newbie this is great, they can have their first
> linux system up and running in no time.
I have to disagree here, because of the fact that those GUI installers
(at least those I have seen lately, speaking of SuSE 8.0 and RedHat 7.3)
hare also supposed to be pretty buggy. Of course, in case they might
work they probably will be of help to any 'newbie' to get the system
installed and running. Otherwise, while crashing or running into an
installer bug, those things are a pain in the ass even to those who
actually know what to do to get the system running but (in those
situations) are tied to use an installer which doesn't allow doing what
needs to be done. This is basically bad. Actually, being into computers
for quite some time now, I am then and now a fan of the idea that there
should be an 'administrator' and a 'user'. I don't think it's a good
thing to create an operating system that might be installed even in case
the person installing it doesn't at all know what to do - get real,
installing an operating system is more than just installing a computer
game or something like that, and also a GUI-based installer doesn't keep
you from just _knowing_ some facts. For example, while installing SuSE:
If you don't _know_ what a hard disk partition is, you will not
understand what happens there, no matter whether it happens in a GUI or
in a cli interface. Likewise, if you don't know about networking,
ip-addresses, netmasks and such stuff, you'll not be able to correctly
configure your LAN access, no matter how fancy the network configuration
dialog is. Thus, perhaps it would be good not to too much import the
"everyone needs to be able to install it" - concept out of the MS
Windows world but to rather stick to an idea of "you'll get a system
that just _works_ and lets you _work_, there's always someone who will
set it up for you so you don't have to care about this".
> When I first learned about linux, the gui's didn't actually tell me
> which files were being edited when your in X. There were fancy gui's
> apps to do stuff, and they worked, but if I ever had to administer a
> linux box without X, I was hooped. I wouldn't even know where to
> start. Anyway, I'm just trying to say that (in my case)Debian forced
> me to learn linux and I thank them for it. :)
That's what I mean. :) I guess that, in any case, installing an OS needs
you to read and learn, and for what I have seen, the Debian GNU/Linux
installer (which IMHO is the best GNU/Linux installer so far) may be
learned how to use by just reading some documentation. This is good.
Looking at all the computers that I am having on my desk week by week,
and seeing all the Windows installations that failed because the person
trying them didn't know what to do, I am afraid soon to see a lot of
GNU/Linux installations that also failed because the installer of the
package encouraged someone to install the system even while knowing
nothing about it at all..
now flame me. :)
Cheers,
Kris
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