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Re: sysvinit is still here, and here to stay for jessie (was Re: systemd is here to stay, get over it now)

The Wanderer dijo [Thu, Jul 03, 2014 at 11:18:12PM -0400]:
> > It must work without systemd well enough to be able to cleanly reboot
> > the system from the GUI, after upgrading.
> > 
> > Anything beyond that is nice-to-have, but definitely NOT required.
> I, for one, would be highly displeased if a routine dist-upgrade to
> testing required me to reboot to avoid having things break.

Of course. But then again, how much is "routine" a change that
implements a long-discussed decision that took so many months and
flames to reach and settle.


The decision is taken and settled. Yes, we must find a way to
harmonize it with the different init systems existing in the archive,
and the non-Linux ports of Debian. But the decision is taken.

> I generally dist-upgrade my primary computer to testing about once a
> week, give or take, but I don't reboot it more often than once a month -
> more commonly three to six months, and I'd prefer that to be longer if
> possible. (And often when I do reboot, it's due to a power outage that
> overwhelms my UPS.)

FWIW, my unstable system didn't break or anything after I upgraded it
to systemd. Yes, I rebooted within a week, but it was not "a reboot is
needed to keep this system operational" in any way.

> I would argue that in order for Jessie to be "the most awesome stable
> release [...] ever prepared", it must work without systemd well enough
> to let everything that worked before the upgrade to Jessie continue to
> work equally well until the user decides to reboot - whether that's
> immediately, or six months down the line. Previous releases could
> successfully be used that way, after all; I've done it with at least one
> of them.

Hate mails rehashing the arguments that should have already died
months ago won't make Jessie any more awesome.

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