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Re: Old-timer installer, task-sysvinit?

Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> writes:

> Quoting Cyril Brulebois (2014-11-23 14:31:00)
>> Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> (2014-11-23):
>>>> If you're unhappy about the initial systemd installation, that's too 
>>>> bad, because we're not going to change debootstrap, especially not 
>>>> at this late stage of the release cycle, to behave differently 
>>>> depending on the target distribution. The current script covers all 
>>>> suites from etch (etch, lenny, squeeze, wheey, jessie, and now 
>>>> stretch), and it'd really be nice if that could stay the case.
>>> I am unhappy about the need for messing non-declaratively with 
>>> debian-installer in order to override default choice of init system.
>>> It is nice that debian-installer provides hooks to do dangerous 
>>> things, but I find it worrisome that changing init system involves 
>>> use of that.
>> I'm not sure why you're considering or calling preseeding “dangerous”.
> Use of a root shell can turn a Debian system into a non-Debian system 
> (by messing with the system in ways not following our defined rules).  
> Blame is on the user for doing so.  Typos are unsupported.
> Use of declarative hints should make it hard to do the same.  I would 
> expect it to be treated as a bug if some hint wreaks havoc without at 
> least popping up a strong warning first.

Ah, oh well then.

If one starts preseeding many of the internal bits of d-i, one can do
pretty much anything you like (and loads of things you don't like ;-) ).

If you're worried about recomending such things, I'd say that the way to
go is with a standard install, and then using some nice package manager
interface to change the init system.

If you want a way to do a non-shell based preseed, you _may_ be able to
get away with some combination of these:

Template: base-installer/includes
Type: string
Description: for internal use; can be preseeded
 Packages to be included in base installation

Template: base-installer/excludes
Type: string
Description: for internal use; can be preseeded
 Packages to be excluded in base installation

Template: pkgsel/include
Type: string
Description: for internal use; can be preseeded
 Comma/space-separated list of extra packages to install

Although you'd need to test that (I seem to remember them not doing
quite what I'd expected when I tried using them a long time ago, at
least when it came to excludes, so I've not touched them since).

TBH, given that one of the apparent selling features of sysvinit is how
nice it is to be able to do whatever one likes with a few lines of
shell, it strikes me as a bit odd to be shy of using a single shell
command to get what one wants.  Who is the target audience here?

Also, it _is_ preseeding to set this:

Template: preseed/late_command
Type: string
Description: for internal use; can be preseeded     <--- See?
 Shell command or commands to run in the d-i environment as late as possible

Then again, I've used d-i as a presentation tool[1] -- I'm clearly deranged.

Cheers, Phil.

[1] http://hands.com/d-i/lenny/classes/ukuug06/early_script
|)|  Philip Hands  [+44 (0)20 8530 9560]  HANDS.COM Ltd.
|-|  http://www.hands.com/    http://ftp.uk.debian.org/
|(|  Hugo-Klemm-Strasse 34,   21075 Hamburg,    GERMANY

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