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Re: debian-women obscurity, was: Clarification about krooger's platform

Erinn Clark <erinn@double-helix.org> wrote:
> > could get a voice within the debian-women culture. Probably
> > a lot of the time that will be directing to FAQs or codes,
> > but there's always something not covered there. Using a
> > smaller number of people makes it easier to spot new conduct
> > FAQs without overwhelming the list while people acculturate(?).
> Yes. IIRC, this was applied to you which you disliked -- many of us
> attempted to speak to you off-list and tell you why your on-list attempts
> at engaging us weren't working. Alas...

It wasn't applied to me. I suddenly had numerous people contacting
me on- and off-list and I found most of them pretty offensive.
That's why I suggested a troll advisor: part announcement, part

> > I think you've not felt the need because debian-women hasn't
> > been communicating with the rest of the project as much as when
> > Amaya sent out that mailshot.
> This is false. We regularly send updates to DWN (which we've already
> established you don't read, but that's not our fault). Many members of DW,
> specifically people in charge of it, are not DDs yet so we don't send
> emails to d-d-a (yet).

Amaya's mailshot is a larger message to a larger number of
DDs than anything DW have sent out since, isn't it? I think
"debian-women hasn't been communicating with the rest of
the project as much" is still true despite some updates in
"not an intra-project-communications medium".  (quote from

If you want to communicate with debian, DWN isn't it. I'm sure
there are friendly DDs who will send important news to d-d-a
if asked. Even I would, but we'd probably disagree what's
important. Please appoint one.

> I think all we learned was to ignore people we consider destructive to our
> goals. So yeah, I'm pretty sure that was the best thing. [...]

We disagree, then. I think DW learned to hide more.

> Something you may not be understanding is that we have had these debates
> about a thousand times. They are not interesting, new, or fun. [...]

No political decision is ever beyond scrutiny. If you don't want
scrutiny on the DW list, then just direct it elsewhere, please.
Don't participate if you think it's irrelevant.

There was some confusion about the right place, back then.

> Well, I've said my piece and don't plan to comment anymore. I've also set
> the M-f-T accordingly for those who wish to continue the discussion.

I think that's unhelpful, like the old usenet habit of setting FUs
to alt.flame or AST. debian-project might be more appropriate.

I had hoped more DPL candidates would weigh in. Maybe there'll be
more in the debate, or maybe they're ashamed of their views now. ;-)

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