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Re: radeonhd removed from Testing ... in February, still gone?

On Mon, 02 Jan 2012 11:07:16 -0500, Carl Fink wrote:

> On Mon, Jan 02, 2012 at 03:35:10PM +0000, Camale?n wrote:
>> Yes, that would be nice. But again, this "message" uses to be at the
>> logs. A pop-up window will require users to be inside some kind of
>> grahical desktop (GNOME, KDE, XFCE...) and that's not always the case.
> Not at all. Many other packages uses a curses-based system to force
> users to read and confirm a message while installing.

"While installing". Yes, but that messages pop-up on a console or 
terminal, not when users are browsing the web or doing  another tasks.

>> Then you should reconsider your whole linux attitude.
>> This is not an isolate case, I'm afraid. Sadly there are not many
>> hardware manufacturers that develop their products taking into account
>> linux not provide completely open source drivers nor even publish their
>> product specs for someone to develop the drivers.
> I didn't say the ideal is reachable. The point of ideals is to provide a
> target, not to be the only solution acceptable. Debian can do better,
> even if it can't meet the impossible goal of perfect usabiliity.

I feel your pain but I think this is not a Debian's issue but a hardware 
manufacturer problematic. If there are no 100% open source that works for 
your card you will:

- Get (by default) a 100% open source driver at start. You will have to 
deal with any bug you may encounter and report it.

- Have the option to either manually install the ATI closed source driver 
or get the additional required proprietary blob code to add 3D 
capabilities to your card.

I think that's a good/almost perfect deal.

A perfect situation would be that amd/ati and nvidia provide full 100% 
open source drivers with no restrictions and full capabilities, but 
dreaming costs nothing...
>> Congrats for having bought a BT hardware that is fully compatible with
>> open source drivers. Next time consider in buying an open source
>> friendly VGA card ;-)
> For a netbook?

> Again: the goal is get *closer* to the perfect experience. Nobody
> (certainly not I) expects to *be* perfect. Don't say "Since it isn't
> possible to be perfect, we'll just be terrible." The current system is
> better than terrible ... but it is bad.

I don't think the current experience with VGA cards is "bad" but 
"annoying". But how can you|we enhance it from Debian's side? Debian 
can't include closed source drivers nor blob by default (the same goes 
for wireless cards that need proprietary drivers...), and that's why most 
of Debian users do love the distribution. I think there are another 
debianized distros (Ubuntu, Mint?) oriented to average users that do 
provide (or at least facilitate) the installation for such closed source 



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