Re: Debian decides to adopt time-based release freezes
Teemu Likonen wrote:
> On 2009-07-30 13:12 (+0200), Sven Joachim wrote:
> >> Probably not, but the release synchronization with Ubuntu may make
>> them feel that they are working for him, which can be a great
>> demotivation.
>
> That's why it would be interesting to hear some concrete ideas how
> useful this would be for the parties. How pros and cons balance? I'll
> start:
>
> Ubuntu
> ======
>
> + Ubuntu always gets a frozen and pretty stable system even if they
> don't communicate at all with Debian. (This is just a mind exercise,
> I'm sure there is some collaboration.)
>
> + Better-quality LTS releases. Happier users and customers.
>
> + More collaboration between Debian and Ubuntu package maintainers and
> teams.
>
> Debian
> ======
>
> + More collaboration between Debian and Ubuntu package maintainers and
> teams.
>
> - Debian developers may feel that it's Ubuntu which they are working
> for in the end. Possibly with the feeling that some of the
> decision-making escapes the Debian developer community. Can be
> demotivating.
>
> - OK, Ubuntu x.04 was released in April but because of their lower
> quality standards and the 6-month release cycle they most likely
> won't be helping Debian to fix the rest of the difficult RC bugs.
> They are already working on their next 6-month period. Ubuntu gets a
> lot of publicity because of the release but Debian always comes "too
> late", literally always after Ubuntu. (It's worth the wait for many
> people but the possible negative publicity can be demotivating for
> Debian community.)
>
> A couple of months later eventually the RC bugs are fixed in Debian
> and there is a release. Ubuntu will apply some of the bug fixes to
> their LTS x.y.1 releases (3-month point release cycle). This can
> make some Debian developers feel that Ubuntu gets something for free
> again without contributing back. Can be demotivating.
>
> + Debian's quality probably won't decrease (except for Squeeze maybe).
>
> + [Please invent more concrete benefits for Debian developers and
> users.]
+ Security fixes prepared for Ubuntu will be (sometimes ?) applicable
directly to Debian, which would be a reduction in workload for the
Debian Security team. (Or phrased differently: Debian and Ubuntu
security teams will be able to prepare security fixes together, for
the same frozen versions.)
- At the release date, the gap between released software and upstream
development versions is bigger in Debian stable than it was in Ubuntu
LTS when it released.
This gap is maybe not important for stability and for the quality of
Debian stable, but it can be in the users' eyes. Remember that most
non-corporate Ubuntu users will use the "latest released version" of
Ubuntu. By such, they are getting "stabilised" versions 3-4 times
during one Debian stable release cycle.
Having Debian stable outdated (with regards to upstream released
versions) is normal and intended. But having the releases synchronised
will IMHO make Debian and Ubuntu LTS very similar. I initially thought
that this would favor Ubuntu, but it might not be necessarily true in
the end.
> Thanks you, all developers! :-)
Thank you for summarizing my thoughts in a somewhat more constructive and
calm way than I did.
Regards,
OdyX
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