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Re: About Debian edu manual terminology, etc.

On Thu, May 09, 2019 at 01:27:23AM +0900, hoxp18 wrote:
> Holger Levsen gave me great advices about ML and terminology,
> so I send my reply to ML now.

thank you. I'll reply to some bits of your mail and hope others will
chime in on the other questions.

> I wrote some on the Weblate, and quote it here.

(I'm not sure what you exactly mean here. So I will just make a general
comment: if you find that something is hard to translate, (usually) dont
try to make the translation more verbose. Instead, make the english
original more clear, so that all translations will benefit.)

>  Added extra explanations about "architecture" since it may confuse
>  users; As a title and/or general English term, or as a technical term,
>  CPU architecure such as amd64, arm, mips, or network architecture
>  as topological design, etc.
>  In addition to that, non-info-tech people in Japan may consider the
>  term "architecture" as a building design, etc.

the audience of the manual are *not* people who know nothing about
computers. the audience of the manual are teachers (and other people)
who have some knowledge about computers.

I know this is a vague definition of audience, but its better than
nothing ;)

>  In short, we should be very careful about the "architecture"
>  in this manual; At least it could be one of "geranal term",
>  "CPU arch", "network design".
>  -- from the source;
>  "The computers running Debian Edu / Skolelinux must have either
>   32 bit (Debian architecture 'i386', oldest supported processors
>   are 686 class ones) or 64 bit (Debian architecture 'amd64')
>   x86 processors."
> So, I translated,
> * Wiki and manual's TOC title "Architecture"
>   -> as something "overview of the system" in Japanese.

Ah. Yes, the chapter is called "Architecture", which is something quite
different from a "CPU architecture". Maybe we should indeed rename the
"Architecture" chapter into something else, like "Design" or "Design

That said, it's definitly also ok, to translate one English word into
two different Japanese/other language words, if the English one has two
meanings, like it has here.

> * CPU archs -> simply in katakana; it's de-fact standard tech term.
> * Network "architecture" -> a bit implicit Japanese, not katakana.
> I feel katakana "Architecture" may confuse people,
> depending who and what kind of job work for.

I trust you that you can find the right words in Japanese! :)

> e.g.)
> * IT tech: both "structure of system" and "CPU arch"
> * construction: "building"
> Since Debian-Edu involves many fields,
> I think there should be some explicit rules about this term.

which term exactly?

> > > * "Main server"
> > > 
> > >    Fuzzy. I feel the Japanese term  as "a centric server",
> > > 
> > >    And what kind of center, then?
> > 
> > "Main server" is the term used in d-i when installing, see
> > https://wiki.debian.org/DebianEdu/Documentation/Buster/Installation?action=AttachFile&do=get&target=08-Choose_Debian_Edu_profile.png
> > 
> > so in the manual translation you should use what is used there
> > (when doing the installation in Japanese), which according to
> > https://sources.debian.org/src/debian-edu-install/2.10.21/debian/po/ja.po/#L40
> > should be:
> > 
> > msgid "Main Server"
> > msgstr "主サーバ"
> Yes, but in the Japanese manual, it's not.
> That term "主サーバ" means "main" almost exactly.
> Current Japanese manual uses different Japanese term.

then please fix the manual! :) If "主サーバ" means "Main Server" and is
the term used in the software, than "主サーバ" should definitlty also be
used in the manual.

> On the other hand, current Japanese manual describes it
> "中心サーバ", sounds like "centric server" or "center server".

the current translation might very well be not the best possible one.

> I myself cannot decide/choose about this.

I hope now you can.

> Current Japanese manual uses katakana "デフォルト" for "default".
> Tech people understand it, yes.
> If the manual is just for those IT-tech people, I think it's fine,
> just I do not like it; avoid using it.

as said, the manual is for IT savy teachers.

> > ask the list :) maybe ask a Japanese debian user list instead of the Edu
> > list? though there is at least one other Japanese speaker lurking on the
> > list :)
> True. I should ask the ja-ML (not now, later...)


> I just expected if some one in edu knows some de-fact in Debian Edu.
> Apology about this.

no need to apology! we definitly know about Debian Edu, just correct terms are
really a difficult things, eg. for long times we had
'thinclient-servers' which were much more than 'thinclient-servers' but
we kept using this name as it was stuck.

> > > Thank you for reading this. Have a nice day.
> > thanks & you too!
> Thank you (again), sorry about very long and complicated post.

that's very fine. it shows nicely how much effort you put into this.
(and you also correctly point out some difficulties in writing a
technical text :)


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