Re: Debian With Alternate Init Systems
Hello,
Svante Signell, le lun. 10 févr. 2020 12:18:37 +0100, a ecrit:
> On Sat, 2020-02-08 at 16:40 +0100, Samuel Thibault wrote:
> > > Nice, the first thing I'll do is to shut down the Debian/GNU Hurd
> > > buildd mahler.
>
> > Can't you see you are here exactly very precisely here *again* putting
> > pressure to get something through?
>
> It is not about pressure, definitely not!
That is however how, I believe, everybody understood it.
> It's frustration on you trying to punish me for having an opinion.
I am not trying to "punish" (I don't even see how that would happen). I
am telling Sam that we have never managed to make you change the *way*
you are expressing your opinions through pressure.
> What do you think would be obtained with the above words?
That you perhaps at least understand that what you were writing above
*is* pressure, even if you don't realize it when writing it.
> BTW: How many euros do you think having a buildd running 24/7 cost me personally
> every month? I'm spending a large amount of my time supporting free software,
> including hosting several buildds (without a single (euro)cent in funding).
I really appreciate the effort you spend here, I am grateful for that.
> > Really, please grow up. You have already worded such a threat in the
> > past. That's at best childish.
>
> I'm asking you to apologize for what you just wrote. The above is an outright
> insult to me.
Right. I apologize for this sentence, I didn't mean to make it an
insult.
The thing is: at some point I don't know how to explain that the way
you are engaging discussions is most often immediately with big words
and everything, and that it's not Okay. On the d-i init question,
there hasn't even been any discussion on debian-boot (and thus no
worded opposition), and then you already said that some developers
"out to leave the project". That's really not a good way to start
a discussion... And this is a recurrent scheme I have seen on IRC
etc., your starting topics is most often already "isn't it about time
to do [...]?". Honestly, when I see such a start, I have no other
will than working on something else than what you are talking about,
and thus your way of suggesting improvements is actually completely
anti-productive. If you simply worded it "could we perhaps do [...]?"
things would flow way better. And similarly on d-i init, discussion can
lead to compromises. I guess you'll again find this coward, like you
already said previously, but really, long-term wise, I have seen it work
way better than immediate battles that rather antagonize people.
Samuel
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