Re: stop posting useless cruft and get to work (systemd and Linux are *fundamentally incompatible* -> and I can prove it)
On 26 March 2014 13:42, Shachar Shemesh <shachar@debian.org> wrote:
[...]
> As far as the systemd vs. upstart discussion, I was leaning in upstart (more
> precisely, against systemd). As such, your email was very interesting to me.
> Unfortunately, it was unreadable. You said you'll start with background, but
> instead of providing technical background, you provided meaningless and
> irrelevant "he said, I said" arguments. Trying to skim ahead to find where
> the meat starts did not easily detect such a point.
>
> At this point, I simply assumed the email had nothing more to say. If I'm
> wrong, feel free to answer with the technical gist of your arguments. If you
> want me to read it, please adhere to the following guidelines:
>
> No more than one page.
> No *asterisks* and -> arrows.
> No references to previous discussions, or other people's arguments
> for/against systemd.
First, here is a version with the asterisks removed. It might be
visually easier to read.
https://lists.debian.org/debian-devel/2014/03/msg00449.html
Second, some concepts need a lot of information communicated to make
sense to those who are not already familiar with the concept. We
don't send people to college for a day and expect them to grasp 4
years of higher education. There are some limits on Human learning
that you have to respect.
But here is the vastly oversimplified technical argument...
The test of comprehension is... if you cannot put an idea into
writing, then you do not understand that idea well enough to be of any
practical use.
If that idea is a program... this means you do not actually have
control of the program when implemented. Our ability to control
things is directly dependent on our knowledge of how that thing
operates. With knowledge, comes the ability to manipulate the thing
to suite our purposes.
Please, tell me what systemd is, fitting its entire functionality as
expressed as one single concept. That does not mean it has to be one
sentence, but it does mean you cannot group different concept together
and simply give that as an answer. Grouping them together is saying
what it does, not what it is. Big difference.
I think you will confirm that neither you, nor I, nor the guy who came
up with the original idea actually understands how it works, and we
will not actually have control of it in situations where we need to
control it. And so we need to pull it out of linux.
-Kev
Reply to: