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Re: [internal-projects] [Debian-multimedia] Start an official internal project!

On Wed, Feb 12, 2003 at 12:26:52PM -0400, marco trevisani wrote:
> Il 12/02/2003 alle 16:14:16, +0100, Francesco P. Lovergine ha scritto:
> > Marco
> > 
> > I knew DeMuDi project by discussions about 'Linux & Music' 
> > with Raffaele De Tintis and Michele Lomuto (people you probably know).
> > My first impression is that the project needs more transparency
> > and use of standard collaborative tools to improve and grow.
> > This is true independently by its involvement as a sub-project
> > in Debian.
> > A developers mailing list needs to be available asap.
> > The same for a cvs repository. All full-time available.
> > Also a todo list and a document of intents are necessary
> > at this stage.
> > This is just my 2 cents ideas...
> > 
> Hi, yes indeed you are right, and i agree with you and this is what
> makes me think that is obviously time to have an official debian-multimedia:

We have currently 5 well-known sub-projects, debian-multimedia could be a 
new one, but you must define many things to clarify what's a multimedia project.
I see only woody-related stuffi there. This is a non-sense. We cannot
work on stable, too many things are now different among woody and sid. 
Packaging needs to be done on sid. A meta-package could be ideal.

> In fact the structure of Debian is transparent and well known by
> maintainers and users, so you dont have to reinvent it...is there.
> cvs, collaborative tools, translation, access to documentation all
> this exists and has a structure in Debian.  

The SF-like framework in Debian is currently in progress.
In the meantime I suggest you upload on SF soon and keep available
fresh information about status of the project and documentation.
Start working and show what's already up. Activating a ML on lists.d.o
is a long process. The same for many other tools (cvs & docs).
Stop talking and start with real stuff and all available tools where
they are available.
Also, you are not a DD, so your capability of using Debian
infrastructure is very limited. 

> Not that DeMuDi was not
> transparent, fact is that Debian has a huge amount of people involved
> while DeMuDi, even under the umbrella of the AGNULA project with money
> from the EU commision is still a few people project and it is of
> course hard to keep track of everything, tasks in Debian are divided
> amongst the volunteers while DeMuDi ends up being a *one man made
> distribution*, or two/three, but it is still a little number if you
> want to come up with a good work.

A lot of good work in debian in the past and in the present
was born as a single-man effort. And this is true for all free software.

> So if the project has not been transparent enough it is because a lack
> of resources and behind our real purpose, which was exactly the
> contrary of what might appear.

> Plus a project like DeMuDi asking for Debian people contribution
> might be seen with suspect (i.e. are they making money out of it...and
> me?), while it would be more practical, fair, clean and clear if
> debian-multimedia exists as an official internal project and if needed
> the internal project might ask for those funding when/if it will be
> needed. 

That's not the point. Starting a sub-project requires knowledge, time
and efforts. Currently www.demudi.org seems at a dead point, to be
honest.  Package list is very limited and outdated (some packages are 
already in sid, some other cannot be in sid for licensing problems). 
Also MLs are not archived.  All these things cannot encourage developers 
to join.  At this point you must demonstrate that demudi is alive. 
And the better way to do it is starting soon a new SF site and fill
of development-related contents. And you must do this... yesterday.

Sorry for being so brutal :) 

Francesco P. Lovergine

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