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Re: moving of dinstall run time on master.

Stephen Crowley <crow@debian.org> writes:

> > I see.  Neither are directories on master.  So I guess that anytime
> > some donor to the project wants to nuke everything in /home/Debian,
> > they have that right, because they're the ones donating the bandwidth
> > (and after all, this would cut down on the bandwidth, could be their
> > argument)?
> >
> Uhhh no. Changing the dinstall time will not affect the project at all.
> Nuking directories WILL affect the project. That is is where the line is
> drawn.

1. This particular change can effect Debian.
   For instance, changing it to an off-peak time in the US may cause
   us to lose tier-1 mirrors elsewhere because they can't afford
   the bandwidth at that time.  This effects us.

2. Allowing them to modify personal files effects us.
   If we have no faith that files on master will be unmutilated,
   we have serious trouble.

> Like I said, deleting things would negatively affect the project so that
> would not be appropriate. They *could* do it, but then debian would have
> every reason to find someone else to host it. You shouldnt bitch about
> things which will not affect anything.

Who decides whether it effects us?  They apparently have here.  We
need to make that decision.

> > Who gets to say whether it will affect the project?  They said "it
> > will be done".  Period.  They gave no option.
> It doesnt take a rocket scientists to figure it out. Either it affects the
> project or it doesnt.

What if they disagree with us on that matter?  They have basically
said our opinions are irrevelant.

> > Ohhh.  I see.  So because somebody gives us stuff, they now have a
> > magical control over the project?  Interesting philosophy.
> No, like i said, they should have control over things which do not affect
> the project. Your generalities dont apply here.

But you are saying that they get to decide what effects the project.
So they say, "x doesn't effect you, so we'll do x" even if x does
impact us.

> > So, let's say that the company hosting Debian decides that, "gee,
> > Joe Developer doesn't need his account because he bought his CDs from
> > somebody else.  Let's just delete it for him because it saves us
> > bandwidth."  You see, while they own the hardware, they don't own the
> > contents or the developers' files.  They were trying to control those
> > things which they don't own, a power which has not been granted to
> > them.
> Let's be realistic, please stop making up these stories (no matter how
> entertaining they may be) and look at the facts. Novare wants to change the
> dinstall time, they are taking suggestions on when to move it to. How is
> this being unreasonable? They could just say "screw it" and pull the
> project. By your reasoning they do not have this right.

How does my reasoning deny this?  Of course they have the right to
pull the bandwidth from us (again, unless we have some sort of
contract).  They do not have the right to tell us how we will run our


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