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Re: Net Install: Installation halts for disk change

On 2/27/20, John Kaufmann <kaufmann@nb.net> wrote:
> On 2020-02-26 22:49, Peter Ehlert wrote:
>> On 2/26/20 7:20 PM, Lee wrote:
>>> On 2/26/20, John Kaufmann <kaufmann@nb.net> wrote:
>>>> For my Thinkpad, I burned CDs with:
>>>>     (1) debian-10.3.0-amd64-netinst.iso
>>>>     (2) firmware-10.3.0-amd64-netinst.iso
>>>> and    (3) firmware-edu-10.3.0-amd64-netinst.iso [just in case]
>>>> A. Disk (1) begins without problem, then stops for wifi firmware:
>>> Try it with one of the non-free network install ISOs from
>>> https://cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/current/multi-arch/iso-cd/
>> I have been using these:
>> https://cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/10.3.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/
>> ...
> Thanks, Peter - but on top of Lee's answer, I'm beginning to get a sense
> that debian.org has /way/ over-complicated the installation images.

I think they don't do a good job of explaining things for newbies -
especially the implications of "free software only" (or whatever term
they use - I'm too lazy to go look) images.

> (If the
> choice of images seems too complicated, that's only because it it.)  For
> example, just look at the pages you and Lee referenced:
> 	Lee:
> cdimage.debian.org/images/unofficial/non-free/images-including-firmware/current/multi-arch/iso-cd/
> 	You:
> cdimage.debian.org/cdimage/unofficial/non-free/cd-including-firmware/10.3.0+nonfree/amd64/iso-cd/
> Two pages to serve the same purpose is WAY too much churn.

except they do NOT serve the same purpose.  I've got machines with
Intel 32 and 64 bit CPUs.  The /multi-arch/ image works for both; the
/amd64/ will work only on an Intel 64 bit cpu.

> Then look at the
> /files/ from those two pages:
> 	Lee's page: [660M] firmware-10.3.0-amd64-i386-netinst.iso
> 	Your  page: [377M] firmware-10.3.0-amd64-netinst.iso
> It's almost as if two different people (or parties) are taking cracks at the
> same issue simply because no one is in charge to rationalize it for the sake
> of the people who matter: Those who are looking for a way to get started on
> Debian.

nit: you're only "looking for a way to get started" once.

Yes, they could make it easier for someone without a linux background,
but look at it as a learning experience :)   And I suspect "the people
who matter" are current Debian users, not the clueless looking for a
MS Windows alternative (like me).

> But it gets even worse: Both pages use the SAME boilerplate text
> above the file links, so it would be easy to confuse them. Even someone who
> has read the instructions
> <https://www.debian.org/releases/stable/i386/ch06.en.html> carefully (as I
> did) has no hint of the unnecessary complications.
> There's no reason there should be two places for people to go for the same
> thing. As it happens, the file from your page is the one I had already
> downloaded [(2) above], but even you did not recognize it because this has
> been over-complicated.

I noticed (2) was the non-free install image..  but the OP booted from
the 'free software only' image and it's not terribly surprising that
the 'find the non-free driver' software failed to find anything on an
ISO image.  It's probably looking for files and doesn't know how to
unpack an ISO image.

> And looking at both files, knowing that they contain
> much of the same material, I'm inclined to think that the other one [at 660M
> rather than 377M] has been more carefully assembled to get as much as
> practicable onto one installation disk.
> I'm taking a lesson from this: some cleanup is in order.

Whereas I think the issue is that most linux documentation assumes too
much background knowledge.  But I suppose that's what the mailing
lists are for - a shortcut for finding out what info you're missing :)


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