Re: Don't disable recoomends by default
On Fri 12 Jul 2019 at 20:21:08 +0300, Reco wrote:
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 12:24:49PM -0300, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> > Quoting Reco (2019-07-12 09:34:17)
> > > On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 09:13:29AM -0300, Jonas Smedegaard wrote:
> > > > Quoting Reco (2019-07-12 09:01:33)
> > > > > > > Disabling installing Recommends by default also helps a great
> > > > > > > deal with all those dependencies you don't want.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Above may break your system in confusing to debug ways,
> > > > >
> > > > > Rly? Recommends are called that for a reason.
> > > >
> > > > Yes, and the reason is well defined: Packages requires in "all but
> > > > unusual installations." - quoted from Debian Policy §7.2.
> > >
> > > This only shows us that one can prove anything by using selective
> > > quoting. Full quote, btw is:
> > >
> > > This declares a strong, but not absolute, dependency.
> > > The Recommends field should list packages that would be found together
> > > with this one in all but unusual installations.
> > >
> > >
> > > Therefore Debian Policy explicitly says that Recommends are not
> > > required.
> > Sorry if you feel that I mislead you by quoting narrowly.
> > I fail to recognize how your larger quote changes my point of mine,
> > however.
> I see nothing to apologise for. You made some bold claims, I showed they
> do not universally apply. Each of us stayed at their respective
> opinions, let's leave it at that.
> > Indeed Debian policy do not _require_ recommendations. They do however
> > recommend to install them except in unusual installations.
> > Turning off recommendations is saying "this system is unusual in all
> > possible ways" which I insist is wrong and bad advice!
> And the key word here is "recommend".
> One of the biggest strengths in the Free Software lies in the putting
> the user in control.
> Mandating to install certain software, assuming that there's only one
> "right" way of doing things, using scare tactics like "system is
> unusual" - this reeks of non-free software from world-known commercial
> entities, and limiting the control of the user over their software.
I do not think any of that diatribe is the intention of Policy.
> I say - if the user wants to "break" a system by not installing the
> Recommends - let them. Whenever it's curiosity, a way of learning
> something new or just a wish to do an OS liposuction.
> Either way it won't break (a hint - Recommends weren't always the
> default), or the user will learn something new in a process.
That's fine too.
> Besides, they don't call Debian the Universal OS for nothing. It can
> tolerate the surprising amount of "breakage".
mc recommends unzip. The OS will get along perfectly well without it.
It's the user who who has to tolerate the breakage.