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Re: [OT] Yet Another Language Issue (wa: imap with claws mail problem)



On Tue, 11 Oct 2011 19:54:59 +0200
Tony van der Hoff <tony@vanderhoff.org> wrote:

> On 11/10/11 19:25, Camaleón wrote:
> > On Tue, 11 Oct 2011 09:58:58 -0700, Al Eridani wrote:
> >
> >> On Tue, Oct 11, 2011 at 9:09 AM, Camaleón<noelamac@gmail.com>
> >> wrote:
> >>
> >>> "Pasao" is not a valid word in Spanish
> >>
> >> Absolutely correct.
> >
> > No, it's not.
> >
> > If you think it is, please send any authoritative reference that
> > points to that direction.
> >
> >>> (you won't find that term
> >>> registered in the RAE dictionary which is nowadays the maximum
> >>> authority that regulates the Spanish language). And Spanish
> >>> language is very strict with its rules and norms.
> >>>
> >>> OTOH, I've found some references to the word "dunno" in English
> >>> dictionaries (e.g., Oxford's, Cambridge Advanced's,
> >>> Thesaurus's...) so you can say its usage can sound "rare" or
> >>> "strange" but incorrect?
> >>
> >> The "DRAE" is prescriptive.
> >
> > Yes, that's what I said.
> >
> >> All the English language dictionaries are merely descriptive, as
> >> there is no "de jure" or "de facto" prescriptive body for the
> >> English language, unlike the bodies for the Spanish or French
> >> languages.
> >
> > And so the validity of "dunno" which does not mean it was the most
> > appropiate term but I already explained why I use that style when
> > posting here (that is, you will not see me to write "dunno" on
> > business writings).
> >
> >> Therefore, the presence of an entry in an English language
> >> dictionary is orthogonal to its correctness, which, for practical
> >> purposes, is a very slippery concept regarding the English
> >> language, anyway.
> >
> > You can't like the usage of a term in a phrase and you could have
> > choosen another one, that's fine, but you can't say is "incorrect".
> > As you say, it's a matter of taste. But this is not valid for
> > Spanish. If you say a word that is no currently available at the
> > RAE's dictonary, is not correct, regardless you find it right or
> > not because is not people who makes the rules but academics.
> >
> >> When somebody gently chided you for using "dunno" and you seemed
> >> genuinely interested in finding out the reason, I tried to help
> >> you by pointing to "pasao", as I assumed that you would be more
> >> familiar with it and that you could make the mental leap from one
> >> to the other.
> >
> > Sorry, but it wasn't a good example.
> >
> 
> Camaleón, English dictionaries contain many words that are in common 
> use, but that doesn't necessarily mean they are "polite", or "used 
> conversationally". I'm sure I don't need to quote examples here.
> 
> As has been pointed out in this thread, "dunno" is by no means rude
> or offensive, but it is not generally used by educated people,
> amongst which I'm sure you wish to be considered. I'm absolutely
> awestruck by your knowledge of English, and only wanted to help you
> in its detailed correct usage.
> 
> By all means use any word you feel helps you make your point; you
> will mostly be understood. However, if you want respect from your
> peers, as you deserve, don't use words or expressions that suggest
> you are less educated than you evidently are.
> 
> Let's leave it at that.

Please let's leave it at that.
At least the other OT threads had some useful information.
This one is appalling.

The use of language is to purvey information, which Cameleon does very
well. Anything over and above that is extraneous to purpose. 
I'm anglophile in language use myself, and there are examples of usage
that vaguely annoy me, but it doesn't deserve this amount of time and
space in what amounts to pseudo-intellectual, petit, selfaggrandisement
at the expense of somebody who appears to donate more to this
list than anyone.

Let's take the examples of idiom from Northumbria to Chipping-Norton to
Sussex and tell me then what is proper usage.
Language is a constantly evolving aspect and 'dunno' could very well
be approved as correct usage tomorrow. Whether or not it is, I
couldn't give a damn. I understand and that's all that is required.
Regards,

Weaver.
-- 
"In a world without walls and fences, 
what need have we for Windows or Gates?"
-Anon.


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