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Re: Which OS? Was "I do consider Ubuntu to be Debian" , Ian Murdock



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Douglas Allan Tutty wrote:
> On Tue, Mar 27, 2007 at 05:41:45AM -0700, Michael M. wrote:
>> On Mon, 2007-03-26 at 16:42 -0400, Michael Pobega wrote:
>>> On Mon, Mar 26, 2007 at 11:35:02AM -0700, Michael M. wrote:
> 
>>> If Debian worried about sticking to a schedule rather than worrying
>>> about the stability of the product, you'd hear about a few more
>>> missing astronauts and a couple of billion dollars gone from (I'm
>>> going on a limb here) some bank data centers. Obviously this is all
>>> worst case scenario, but it's what Debian is primarily made for.
>> Which begs the question, "Is Debian made for me?"
>>
>  
>> What has made Debian a great fit for me over the past months is its
>> beefed up efforts to make testing a more viable option for users (for
>> example, by providing security updates for testing).  I started using
>> Etch some months ago, perhaps close to a year ago, pulling in just a few
>> packages from unstable, and it has been a great fit for me.  Until the
>> past few months, when it has increasingly come to seem stale to me.
>> It's only natural, then, for me to question whether *I* really fit in
>> with your definition of "We the Debian people."
>>
> 
> Why don't we reframe this as:  What is the best OS/Distro for Michael?
> 
> Perhaps you have some conflicting needs that requires a non-standard
> answer?  I _think_ that what I hear that you want is:
> 	
> 	More recent software than what is in stable or testing (when its
> 	frozen).
> 
> 	Less dynamic than Sid
> 
> What about:
> 	
> 	Debian stable or testing to run your hardware with a *buntu in a
> 	chroot?  Gives you a base OS that won't crash but more recent
> 	software.
> 
> Is Linux for you?  What about one of the BSDs?  I've been looking at
> OpenBSD; they release every 6 months (their Release is like Debian's
> Stable), with security update (source patches) as necessary.  Following
> every security update even if it doesn't apply to you, you end up
> running their Stable.  Their Current is like Debian's Sid. 
> 
> They can release every 6 months because they only focus on the main OS.
> Third-party stuff (upstream) is in packages (binary) and ports (source
> tarballs pre-tweaked to compile properly on a given release level).
> Using the ports and packages system is supposed to be similar to
> using aptitude from the command line.  It brings in whatever
> dependancies there are, compiles anything required, and installs it.
> It also will uninstall.
> 
> It sounds to me like this may be a viable option for you:
> 
> 	Stable, reliable, OS
> 
> 	Upgraded every 6 months
> 
> 	Fairly recent third-party software.
> 
> So tell us what your ideal OS would be and do.  There's enough cross-OS
> experience on this list to give good suggestions.
> 
> I'm not marking this thread as OT since a discussion on why Debian may
> not be working for someone, and what a user's needs are, is important
> for Debian folks.  So lets _not_ have a flame fest.  Lets help a debian
> user with a fundamental problem: his OS isn't doing what he needs it to
> do.

Very eloquent Doug.  I agree completely with you.

If someone is looking for recent software, and stability, then Lenny
might be an option when it comes out, but until it does, Etch might be
the best fit.  Sid is not "frozen" as Etch is, but is very cold at the
moment, so even Sid does not offer the newest software like it should.
For example, OOo is 2.04 in Sid, while 2.1 has been "stable" for months
and 2.2 just released.

The problem with Ubuntu is that while it is based on Debian, several key
items are different (restricted modules, sudo/root, etc.) to make it not
appealing to many Debian purists.  Sidux on the other hand offers 100%
compatibility with Debian, and some really smart people helping smooth
any bumps one might experience with it.  Sidux is Sid, with a custom
kernel and a few really good scripts.

For Debian people who might be afraid of running Sid, Sidux might be
just the answer that they were looking for.  However, I would have to
admit that it might be dangerous, and Etch is the safe bet.  It might
not have the latest packages, but it will work as promised.

Joe
- --
Registerd Linux user #443289 at http://counter.li.org/
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