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Re: REALLY OT: News Flash

On Sun, Feb 25, 2007 at 01:43:24PM -0800, Michael M. wrote:
> On Sun, 2007-02-25 at 08:57 -0500, Roberto C. Sanchez wrote:
> > On Sun, Feb 25, 2007 at 08:43:32AM -0500, Michael Pobega wrote:
> > > 
> > > This actually falls into a similar category as one of my favorite 
> > > phrases ever: "There are no atheists in foxholes". 
> > 
> > Well, people do like to pretend that they are in control of the world
> > until they realize that they are not.
> That's something of a non-sequiter.  You seem to be implying that
> atheists pretend they are in control of the world.  I would say it's
> just the reverse:  it's the theists who think they are in control, as in
> "have all the answers."  They look to one of several ancient texts,
> purported to be the words of either a deity or prophet, and decide these
> things are true, ignoring all evidence to the contrary as well as the
> internal contradictions of those texts.
If you meet a Christian (I can't speak for other faiths) who thinks he
or she is in control, then that individual is wrong.  The Bible
explicitly states on numerous occasions that God is ultimately in
control.  Of everything.

Out of curiousity, could you provide evidence of something that
contradicts anything that is written in the Bible?

> It wasn't atheists who launched the Crusades, imprisoned Galileo,
> perpetrated the Inquisition, the Holocaust, or flew planes into the
> World Trade Center.  It's not atheists who deny evolution or claim that
> the Earth is 6,000 years old.  You need religion to do those things --
> the absolute certainty that your faith determines the laws of the
> universe.
First, you are attributing to Christians actions which are the result of
human nature.  The key point of human nature is resistance to change.
The same can be said of the thousands of years of conflict among the
peoples of Asia (especially the Japan, Korea, China are) and yet they
are not predomitantly Christian.

Now, the Crusades were launched in 1095 after over *400* years of Muslim
rule in Jerusalem.  So, who's the instigator now?

The Inquisition was a product of the Roman Catholic Church.  The Roman
Catholic Church, BTW, is an institution.  It does not represent all of
Christianity, only those believe the Roman church's claims of being the
"one true church."

The people who flew planes into the WTC towers were mislead by their so
called "religious" leaders.  In one of the best sermons I ever hear
preached, the preacher said "nothing will take you Hell faster than
religion."  He is right, because it is all about faith in Jesus Christ.
You can belong to as many churches as you want and if you don't believe
and accept salvation, then you are doomed.

You are also conflating religion and faith.  My faith in the Word of God
tells me that it is true.  When the Bible says something, I believe it.
Religion is not that.  Besides, my faith does not determine the laws of
this unvierse.  My faith is determined by those laws.

Of course, I think it takes lots more "faith" to believe that everything
we see and can't see is an accident or happy coincidence than it does to
believe that an omnipotent God created it all.



Roberto C. Sanchez

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