Re: The Debian IRC channel
On Mon, Dec 20, 2004 at 02:53:01PM +0100, Kim wrote:
[...]
} I also consider the current channel as a very unhelpful channel and in
} many cases people who are trying debian for the first time goes there
} only to find a lot of insults if they don't understand at first or if
} they have missed to find some kind of related information. Instead of
} helping to solve the problem people there might actually be a cause for
} other people to quit trying to solve the problems and give up.
There will always be people who are insulting or less than helpful. It
happens less (though it does happen) on a mailing list since it takes a bit
more work to send an email than a message on IRC.
} On the channel there is always a lot of people connected but it seems
} that only a clique of the same people are answering the questions.
Largely true. There tend to be lots of people who just lurk. Perhaps they
are absorbing information. Perhaps they just autoconnect when their client
starts up. It doesn't really matter, as long as there are people who do
answer questions.
} I know that these mailing list a the best place to get help, but if a
} person needs help here and now an irc channel can be very beneficial
} which I experienced at both fedora and linux channel yesterday.
}
} What do you think?
I will generally go to IRC for help first. I don't usually need to go to
the mailing list at all, in fact. While the denizens of #debian tend to
have little patience with people who do not do their due diligence (read
manuals, search google) before asking a question, they are very helpful
when you have done your due diligence. If you even show willingness to read
a manual, you will get pointed to the right section of a manual.
The rudeness comes in when someone shows up in the channel with the
attitude that they are a *customer* and that customer service should be
helping them and they have no responsibility to read anything. There are
also people who, whether it's because English is not their native language
(there are several non-English #debian-<country> channels, such as
#debian-br, to serve those with a non-English native tongue) or because
they can't write, cannot express their problem clearly. These people tend to
get directed to the appropriate non-English channel (which is not always
helpful, since there are almost always fewer people available on the
non-English channels), or ignored, or berated.
There are some DOs and DON'Ts that, if followed, will go a long way toward
making your visit to #debian more pleasant. DO:
- read http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html
- read the channel topic
- read the applicable manual before asking a question
- search google before asking a question
- express yourself clearly and concisely
- be polite
- be prepared to provide versions of packages and kernel
- be prepared to justify your choices (e.g. why are you installing software
XYZ from source instead of using the Debian package?)
- thank those who have tried to help you, whether they succeeded or not
DON'T:
- ask if you can ask a question
- ask if anyone has experience with what you need help on (just ask your
- repeat your unanswered question more often than every 15 minutes
- demand answers
- call people names
- send private messages to anyone (other bots, such as dpkg) without their
express permission
- talk about how much better distro X is than Debian
question)
- flood the channel with error output, configuration lines, or anything
else; first /join #flood, tell whoever is helping you that you will
send the output to #flood, wait until they join #flood, then send the
output. Even better is to use a web pasting service like
nomorepasting.org
} Regards,
} Kim
--Greg
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