Re: PCI graphics cards recommendations
Hi All & Norman,
Michael Moore, right? He doesn't have an axe to grind ...
Prey tell, do you have a point of view, axe to grind or did God/Alah
tell you to type your stuff? Is your line of reasoning beyond critique?
Say, you're quite adept at non-sequiters! That was obvious given your
initial fallacious argument, but more evidence never hurts. I fail to
see what the right to bear arms has to do with this discussion, but
thank you for baring your bias.
How can you know everyone in the USA supports the right to bear arms, if
everyone does not vote? Odd claim to make & trivially false.
Bias? Again, do you think your point of view, is given from on high?
Others are biased, you are not?
Also, notice I said it *might* follow, not that it *does* follow, in
regards to gun control legislation. Ergo not a non-sequiter. Do you
follow? Distinguish necessary vs contingent conclusions. All black cats
are black, is necessary. This cat is black, is contingent on the colour
of this cat.
It's the conversational equivalent of the 30-second sound-bite, something abhorrent to politics and knowledge in general.
Really, I must have missed that in my Philosophy degree! I would have
thought a line of reasoning, for a conclusion, is only reasonable.
Abhorrent? Spare me the pompous, self righteous drivel.
The reason voter turnout hovers around 40% is because the other 60%
can't be troubled to take the time to educate themselves on what is
going on. Personally, I am glad these people don't vote; the American
founding fathers desired an "informed electorate". Uninformed voters
are not unlike guns with irresponsible owners, to borrow from your
Platonic reasoning at its finest; to wit, an argument for elitism. I
guess you think your on the Right side of that line?
Your argument for "responsible gun owners," is called the "all true
Scotsman ploy;" and yes, it is fallacious.
A claim that the American democracy is the longest active democracy,
would seem to ignore black people, indigenous Americans and women? An
odd position for Powell to take, indeed an absurd one. No Nathan, if you
mean democracy in the modern sense of it, America is not the oldest.
Clearly, some Americans believe it, but they would be wrong.
Democracy is a word. Words mean things. We're arguing about
something Colin Powell said, not something I said. If you have a tape
of me stating that the United States is the world's oldest democracy,
please bring it forth. Otherwise, I suggest you not attribute
statements to me until I've said them.
Yes, you are right, democracy is a word.....
Your getting muddled. I am pointing out here, that the American
"democracy," when it started off, only had a very limited franchise and
is not a "democracy," as we use the term in The West *now*..... In the
latter modern sense, America only became a "democracy," when black
people & women got the vote.
Regarding your other points, do you claim that the ancient Greeks did
not keep slaves? Did they allow their slaves a vote? Did the citizens
of Sparta get a vote? Isn't it a fact that Socrates and Plato
despised the democratic government?
Exactly! The ancient Hellenic/Greek democracy, was of a very limited
sort, compared to the modern instances. Plato & Aristotle, were not
democratic, but Socrates, I dunno.
Ah, but you did use the existence of the "Ancient Hellenic Democracy"
as "proof" that Colin Powell does not understand history. Either you
meant that Colin Powell didn't know that no-one had attempted a
democratic government before the formation of the United States, or
you meant that the "Ancient Hellenic Democracy" is still in
existence, or you claim that the United States is not a democracy at
all. If that is your claim (as it appears to be), then trotting forth
the "Ancient Hellenic Democracy" serves no purpose and is superfluous.
I tried pointing this out to you twice now.
Wrong analysis, ergo two false consequences drawn. See the above, where
I draw a distinction, between different *types* of democracy. To repeat...
I am pointing out here, that the American "democracy," when it started
off, only had a very limited franchise and is not a "democracy," as we
use the term in The West *now*..... In the latter modern sense, America
only became a "democracy," when black people & women got the vote.
As for the treatment of Indigenous Americans, that is literally
criminal. Read "Bury My Heart at Wounded Knee", by Dee Brown & weep.
Personally, I know for a fact that the United States is not a
democracy; it's a representative republic where the representatives
are (purportedly) elected in a democratic fashion. It drives me crazy
when people say the United States is a "democracy"; the only
democracies I am aware of today are Iceland and Switzerland (and
there's some question if the recent changes to the Swiss constitution
leave the Swiss democracy intact).
Eh? You need to read a tad more widely dude, that is just plain wrong.
I am aware that the United States has done al"I think the American policy is evil and entirely based on ignorance of what war really is, and I am marching today because I have some experience of what war really means," says World War II veteran John Sage.l kinds of things using
various agencies; I don't think I ever attempted to defend that.
Welcome to international politics, where everyone is the bad guy.
Yes, the USA has & is about to again.
But lets get a tad less pessimistic & cynical? The USA has & is doing
some great things too! I suggest we look at each case one at a time,
rather than saying something like, "USA" (or any other country) bad,
"Iraq" (or any other country) good. It will take longer, but it will
yield greater verisimilitude.
Please direct further replies _off list_.
No thanx, I would rather not carry on this discussion with you on or off
I would rather agree to disagree and leave it at that. Hmmm, does that
mean I have a democratic attitude? ;-)
Normal transmission, of Tuxian stuff will now resume :-)
Greek (Democratic) Geek :-)
(I keep thinking of the old father in "My big fat Greek Wedding" when
ever I look at the Hellenic root of "English" words. ARGH!!!!)
"I think the American policy is evil and entirely based on ignorance of
what war really is, and I am marching today because I have some
experience of what war really means," says World War II veteran John
Sage. NZ Herald, Feb 14th.