Re: Why is setting up X so arcane?
In article <[🔎] 20010628152846.K8079@topaz.mdcc.cx>, Joost Kooij wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 28, 2001 at 01:45:31PM +0100, Nikki Locke wrote:
> > I have a machine here I would like to run X on. I am not sure of the
> > specs of the VGA card, and have no manuals for it. I think I have a
> > manual for the monitor (it has no manufacturer marked on it, but I have
> > found a single sheet of paper which has a picture on it that looks
> > vaguely like the front on my monitor).
>
> You must know what kind of vga card you have.
Why must I know? I bought the machine about 4 years ago. I have moved house
twice since then, and no longer have the receipt, or the manuals.
> If you cannot make it
> clear to xfree86 what type of chip it is to be dealing with, how can it
> know what registers to program on the chip?
As far as I know, the card is Plug and Play. Why can't X probe the card and
find out for me?
> You need to know only the monitor's horizontal and vertical scan frequency
> maximum and minimum values. Together with the vga card's max dotclock
> and available memory, these determine the screen resolutions that are
> possible.
I have found a sheet of paper that might be the monitor's manual, and got
the scan frequencies from there. But how am I supposed to find out the vag
card dotclock frequency?
> > How on earth am I supposed to set up X?
>
> Ancient rites must be performed, it's called rtfm. But unlike setting
> up scsi, there's no live animals involved.
I have read pages and pages of stuff. I have understood maybe half of it. I
still don't know hwat my VGA card is.
> > Why is it so difficult? I can install Microsoft Windows (spit), and it
> > will find out for itself what card and monitor I have, and set itself
> > up accordingly. Why isn't there a program to do the same thing with X?
>
> No it doesn't. If you install windows 95, it puts you in 640x480x16 IIRC.
> Unless your vga card is so bloody ancient that they included a driver
> on the cd. You have to tune it yourself afterwards, by installing
> the correct driver for your card and monitor, and setting these up to
> your needs. Surely you must know enough details about your hardware,
> or you would not be able to choose and install a driver in windows.
All I do is put the WIndows 2000 CD in the drive, and start the install. I
don't have to install any special drivers, Windows recognises the card and
installs it to run at 1024x768.
> I'm sick and tired of hearing "but it's so easy in windows". If you only
> knew how many windows users I have given a monitor upgrade, simply by
> pressing a few buttons on the bottom of the monitor, and making the 2"
> black frame that surronds their desktop disappear. Sheer magic.
I may be stupid not understanding what my VGA card is, and not really
wanting to know what a dotclock frequency is, but I am not quite as stupid
as that - I am capable of adjusting the picture size on my monitor :-)
> If you want a windows-like linux, by all means install suse or mandrake.
> They (especially suse) put a lot of effort in xfree86 installers.
> But you'll miss all the fun of understanding how it works and what's
> really going on. IMHO that's a big part of what linux is about.
Interesting definition of fun :-) I don't find configuration much fun,
particularly when I have to spend days finding out stuff I don't really want
to know. I'd much rather get on with some work. I like Debian because its
package installation is so simple, but it really falls down when it gets to
configuring X.
> Go read the X-files at http://xfree86.org.
On my way.
[Later]
I booted Windows NT, and asked it about the VGA card. It said I had ...
s3 compatible display adapter
Chip Type S3 Vision964
DAC Type: Brooktree Bt485
Memory size: 2MB
Adapter String: Diamond Stealth
Which documents should I be reading?
I had a look at "XFree86 Video Card and X server list", and it said
S3 964 (generic) ....................................... XF86_S3
and a lot of the Diamond cards said the same.
I attempted to read XFree86 configuration guide (which the FAW said is
available from http://www.XFree86.org/3.3.5/Config.html) but I got "The
requested URL /3.3.5/Config.html was not found on this server".
So, having drawn a blank, I went in and used XF86Setup to set up the S3
driver, but clicking the "Done" button hung my machine solid. Rebooting
showed my filesystems to be partly trashed. Oh great!
I'll restate my original complaint - Why is it so difficult to set up X?
--
Nikki Locke, Trumphurst Ltd. PC & Unix consultancy & programming
nikki@trumphurst.com http://www.trumphurst.com/
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