Re: Is Debian the last OS ? (Long reply)
Hello!
Adam is right, I think. The other distros have had the glibc 2.1 in their
stable releases much earlier than debian, for example.
So I had to install a potato base system about a half year ago (BTW, it runs
fine although it was not even close to the first test cycle that time).
But it is a very uncomfortable way to download packages over a modem 56k
connection. And these connections (or the slightly faster 64k ISDN ones) are
usual here in Germany. So I use a mix of packages from my Slink CD set which
I bought and some new downloaded packages. However, you cannot tell any
normal simple desktop user that he has to download packages to get a distro
with recent packages. Or that he has to obey that some packages of slink
cause problems when installing a 2.2. kernel. So, many people in Germany (or
lets say, really all of my friends using linux) install SUSE with these
absolutely wonderful yast and sax tools and a bunch of, I must confess, more
actual packages from a CD set.
If I want recent software, I compile it myself, so I always get the newest
versions. But I must say, that a selection of recent deb packages installed
is a more comfortable thing then a selection of self-compiled and installed
source-code packages which I cannot uninstall any more. And so IMHO, this is
a real disadvantage of debian, that it releases major updates not very
often.
So, after this issue, I wanna write how I came to use debian and why I'm
convinced of it. It's my first distribution, and I really liked it from the
beginning. Here in Germany, Debian always gets very bad marks in tests
because the PC magazines write that, although it's very reliable it is so
difficult to use. But I think that's not true. I first got hamm (and later
slink) on two CDs bundled with an introduction to debian and the main tools
("CHIP" PC magazine). And I got it installed quite without problems. The
only thing which I regarded as bad were some really outdated packages in
hamm (see the above issue). Some months later, I helped a friend who had
problems with a SUSE setup. When I wanted to configure something, YAST
crashed, and after this I was absolutely convinced of using debian and not
SUSE because debian tools work reliably. SUSE has not even a tool like
modconf!!!
When I had to install Linux on a SparcStation IPX at school which only had a
floppy drive and a network connection, I was very glad that I could install
the base system using a nice set of boot floppies. I don't think this is
easily possible with RedHat!? This machine which is used as file server has
never crashed for months now.
So far,
Kind Regards,
Stephan Hachinger
----- Original Message -----
From: "Adam Scriven" <scriven@lore.com>
To: "Olaf Meeuwissen" <olaf@epkowa.co.jp>; <debian-user@lists.debian.org>
Sent: Monday, July 31, 2000 1:25 PM
Subject: Re: Is Debian the last OS ? (Long reply)
> At 12:48 2000/07/31 +0900, you wrote:
> >Adam Scriven <scriven@lore.com> writes:
> > > So, for him to go to 2.2, and get the upgrades that he wants, he
> > > needs to reinstall. He has no problem with this, and I've recommend
> > > Debian, but no matter how "stable" the frozen version is, it IS
> > > STILL frozen, and not the officially released version, so he's not
> > > comfortable switching to it.
> >
> >Upgrading from slink to potato is a breeze. Besides potato is rumored to
> >become stable in August.
>
> That's good news, anyway.
>
> >I've been running and updating potato regularly for about a year without
> >any major trouble.
>
> And I've been running it for 6 months, probably.
> Some minor hiccups, but nothing I couldn't handle.
>
> >I guess the biggest hickup was caused by updating to emacs20-20.7. It
> >screwed my gnus setup, but installing the seperately packaged gnus
package
> >fixed everything. Note, these ripples were caused by changes within
> >potato and had nothing to do with upgrading from slink.
>
> I understand, but that's partially my point. Potato was still changing,
> but to change from 2.0.36 RH to 2.0.36 Debian doesn't make any sense to
> him, since he's got his RH system working just as he wants, and he
> understands it enough to be relatively comfortable with it.
>
> >Has he ever tried a RedHat x.0 release? From what I heard these are as
> >buggy as, likely even buggier than, Debian's frozen releases. It is just
> >what an organization is prepared to call an official release.
>
> I don't think he's ever tried a X.0 release, but that's just a question of
> timing.
> Living in rural Ontario there are no computer stores anywhere that carry
> Linux, so he buys stuff when he comes up here to visit me, or if I bring
> stuff down to him.
> As soon as it's available in stores (or I get my CD burner), I'll bring
him
> a copy of the potato CD, but that'll be a stable version of potato (or
> _very_ close too, from a release schedule POV).
>
> > > So that leaves him with RedHat, since he understands it.
> >
> >Sounds like he doesn't want to (or can't) put in some effort.
>
> He puts in as much effort as he can afford, for a hobby. He uses it for
> checking e-mail, he's looked into getting completely rid of Windows and
> using Linux exclusively (and he would if he could find a couple of
> replacements for windows programs that he likes).
> Soon he'll be delving into the wonders of kernel re-compilation, and yes,
> when people get over that hurdle, it's much easier to do certain
> things. My point was, and continues to be, that Debian, with the slow
> release schedule, has had people avoid it. They're looking for an
> officially released version, with the options that they need.
> He's perfectly happy to stay with 2.0.36. Diald works, he understands his
> system enough that it does what he wants, but he recognizes that it would
> do more things, and it would do the same things better, if he were to use
> some of the features he's heard about in 2.2, but officially Debian
doesn't
> support it yet, even though it's been out for a very long time.
>
> Thanks again!
> Adam
> Toronto, Ontario, Canada
>
>
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