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Re: Fortunes-off - do we need this as a package for Bookworm?



"G. Branden Robinson" <g.branden.robinson@gmail.com> wrote on 20/11/2022 at 00:22:29+0100:

> [[PGP Signed Part:No public key for D19E9C7D71266DCE created at 2022-11-20T00:22:22+0100 using RSA]]
> At 2022-11-19T23:07:50+0100, Dominik George wrote:
>> > Right, and has has been discussed before (more times than can be
>> > counted, most likely) having some sort of content does not imply that
>> > the ideology itself is promoted.  The presence of the texts of the
>> > Torah, the Christian Bible, the Quran, and other holy books in Debian
>> > does not mean that Debian as an organization supports all of the various
>> > ideologies entailed therein.
>> 
>> You should probably take a history book and look up again what the
>> author of Mein Kampf did, and compare that to what the authors of the
>> other texts you mention did.
>
> You should probably read Numbers, Joshua, and Judges (attend
> particularly to the fate of the Midianites), as well as the centuries of
> history of Christian and Muslim expansion and global colonization.
>
>> Then, should you still find that murdering 6 million Jews in what is
>> known as the Holocaust can be compared to ideas of anarchism,
>> Christianity or the Islam, I fail to assume good faith.
>
> It's a good thing we take so little time to remember the non-Jewish
> victims of the Holocaust, isn't it (non-heterosexuals, Roma, Slavs,
> the mentally ill or disabled, communists, labor organizers, and
> non-conformists of many sorts).  Let's pay particularly little attention
> to those that might be going on today.
>
> I concede that anarchists have made a poor showing in the slaughter
> sweepstakes of global history.  As in Spain from 1936-1939, we usually
> find that liberal capitalists, authoritarian communists, royalist
> revanchists, and the Roman Catholic Church, all frequently in conflict
> with each other, can come rapidly to an ecumenical consensus, even under
> circumstances of war, that democratic socialists and everyone to the
> left of them need to be expediently liquidated and utterly forgotten.
>
> On that note, to indulge in recollection of institutional memory here, I
> believe it was our second DPL Bruce Perens who first decreed that
> "fortunes-off" needed to be excised from the formerly monolithic cookie
> collection for the fortune(1) program; it was not thus segregated by our
> upstream.  His rationale was that the Debian distribution badly needed
> to be made more palatable to the tender sensibilities of corporations
> that might otherwise find no excuse to make a deal with Red Hat Software
> instead.  Debian's "apt", now widely recognized as a terrific innovation
> in package management due to its automatic dependency resolution with
> cycle-breaking, was forcibly renamed at Bruce's direction from "deity",
> which he also thought might unduly alarm the tender-hearted
> philanthropic sensibilities in C suites throughout Silicon Valley.
>
> By autocratic pronouncements such as these, many years ago the Debian
> distribution was molded and reshaped to make itself more congruent with
> the demands of U.S. tech sector capitalism.  The problem with this is
> less that it situates Debian more comfortably within what we might term
> a militantly centrist Anglo-American politics (with Schumpeterian
> "creative destruction" for tech entrepreneurs and venture capitalists
> followed by pervasive rent-seeking and financialization as a firm
> matures), than that people don't critically examine these processes and
> acknowledge them as themselves inherently political.  This very
> paragraph, if uttered aloud in a Fortune 50 workplace in front of the
> right (or wrong) ears, might mark one as "not a team player" and unfit
> for professional advancement.  (At the same time, if you share your
> ideas for market disruption or rent extraction discreetly to the right
> management consultants who can then vouch for you, the sky's the limit,
> if you have a way to cash out your options/cryptos before the people
> higher than you on the pyramid do.)
>
> Debian can discard fortunes-off if it wants to; I'm not sure I could
> motivate myself to vote in a GR regarding that question if it came to
> pass.  But if any Debian contributor thinks that by doing so we make
> Debian somehow more "ideologically neutral", or less encumbered by
> political doctrine, that person is as self-deluded as anyone who finds a
> Rosetta stone in _The Protocols of the Elders of Zion_.
>
> Regards,

I'm personally fine to defend the "less neutral" position we take by
dropping fortunes-off which is total garbage.

-- 
PEB

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