Re: [debian-knoppix] Knoppix installed on HD: still not a standard Debian!
Gilles Pelletier wrote:
On August 1, 2003 12:52 pm, you wrote:
Klaus _will_ NOT support intsallation of Knoppxi to HD. This is
not the aim of Knoppix!!!
I suppose you made a typo here: you mean it's not the aim of
Knopper. Because if you look at the forums, you'll find that
though, just like Achim, users think Knoppix can be very helpful
as a Live-CD, they're really craving to install it on their HD
because it works so well.
you still dont understand how it works, right?
If Knoppix was a private company looking forward to "keep the
customer satisfied", HD installation would have been a thing done
months ago.
nope, you didn't understand...
That's why there's no reason for hype about Linux: we're loosing
the game. There is something wrong about the development model.
Linux is developed "en vase clos" (in uncommunicating vessels? :)
by developpers who don't give a damn about end users. If they're
not satisfied, they should learn programming, and that's it! What
remains to be seen is what programmers will think when their
dentist turns out to be another programmer...
you dont understand how the developement of linux works. you should also
note that the platform "linux" contains thousends of subprojects. the
linux kernel is an other one.
it's a great operarating system because it is developed that way.
"release ealry and often" is a key concept for the kernel, other
projects may choose the same strategy or an other. it is a good concept
especialy when the developer never meet each other. the developement is
coordinated through mailinglists and IRC chats. releasing eraly ensures
that the code is used and that bugs are found when they are easy to fix,
releasing often reduces the amount of double work.
and you should not throw all developers in one pot. the linux platform
is developed by thousends of individuals. you can not say that none of
them cares about users, some sure do.
[...]
With some chance you can find that old boot floppy and it's still
working... (Case with Slackware)
other people on this list use knoppix to rescue their systems and don't
use boot floppies any more ;-)
[...]
Then came Knoppix, which had a good development model and seemed
to care about end-users the way Windows freeware developpers do.
IT WORKED without wondering and pondering for hours. Like
everybody, I wanted to install it a year ago.
Unfortunately, KK, you know that guy who's put Knoppix together,
says he doesn't give a damn about HD installation. Christian
Perle got to understand the inner workings of Knoppix to write a
script only to give up after a few months. (Busy, pissed off of
being a hidden feature? God knows!)
i'm sure HE knows. i don't think he has given up or is offended by
something. his installer worked for many people and he may not have to
motivation to do a bigger installer. and don't forget that all the
developers for knoppix work in their free time, they are not paid to do so.
Now, you, Fabian Franz, are also learning the inner workings and
starting so much from scratch that you say you can't produce a
boot floppy yet, which means it's still no use installing Knoppix
on HD. What will happen if you get busy, pissed off after 9
months while nobody is overseeing the project? Somebody will
start from scratch again?
what is your problem with that? your against other people devoting their
free time to a project? nobody forces you to use the programs they produce.
Will there be a 3th, a 4th, a 10th year of Linux on the desktop? I
mean, is there still anybody here to think that the
ready-when-it's-ready philosophy will make the grade?
it the only philosophy that works, until somebody spends a lot of mony
and hires the developers and puts them in one room.
or would you like to be forced to finish something on date what you are
doing it as hobby?
[...]
It's driving me
N N U U TTTTTTTTTT SSSSSSS
N N N U U T S
N N N U U T S
N N N U U T S
N N N U U T S
N N N U U T S
N NN UUU T SSSSSSS
yeah, we can see it...
maybe switch of the PC for some time and relax with a book or so.
God damned stupid programmers!
you go too far. you are insulting a lot of people. i don't see a reason
why anybody should help you get your problems fixed when you treat
people that way.
> They remind me of an uncle of mine
who was a mechanic. He could take a whole car down to pieces to
the last bolt and put it back together. Since everybody came to
him with the vaguest approximative mechanical concepts, he
thought everybody was crazy and he was the king of the world in
any of its aspect.
Today, programmers are like mechanics 30 years ago. When they are
not "ruled" inside a company like Microsoft or Apple, they think
they are the kings of the world and nobody has anything to teach
them.
absolutely not. have not yet met a programmer with megalomania.
programming is a creative and very complex art. even simple projects
contain thousands of instructions - much more parts than any real word
products, except the space shuttle maybe ;-)
consider that a software has to work on many different computers each
with different setup. a programmer is no clairvoyant, he can not foresee
each bug, but all programmers try to make error free programs.
But, IMHO, what the Linux world needs now is the dreaded SUITS,
for planning and organisation!!!
that work for no or almost no money...
groups that do lobbying and fight against unfair rules should be more.
there are many companies out there that try to steal the users rights. :-(
So, what can I say, I'm a dummy since I'm not a programmer and Mr
Knopper will continue doing things his way.
yes and his way is quiet ok. it produces the best bootable CD that is
out there.
chris
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