Re: do not delete gnome-1
Hi,
On Tue, Sep 27, 2005, Thomas Bushnell BSG wrote:
> > And what if they never do the switch? We can't keep GNOME 1 forever.
> If you cannot maintain them any longer, then you should orphan them.
> This is always appropriate. In fact, it's necessary. When you cannot
> maintain or do not wish to maintain a package, orphan it.
I understand that I can orphan packages. GNOME 1 was superseded by
GNOME 2, and GNOME 2 provides similar functionality, replacing GNOME 1.
GNOME 1 was kept for a period of _transition_ from GNOME 1 to GNOME 2.
When transitions are over, packages are removed. The GNOME transition
is not eternal.
> This is such a simple thing, I don't know why it so often causes such
> struggles. There is no need to declare whether *other* people should
> maintain it or not. If you don't want to, then don't. Declare it
> orphaned, and be done with it. You have no further responsibilities.
I'm concerned for the project as a whole, I'm concerned with the number
of packages in Debian, the number of packages to release, upgrade
paths, the number of packages to maintain at the security level, the
size of the archive, the valuable time of the QA group. Yes, I
understood you're in the QA group.
Don't encourage people every old cruft to the QA group, it means more
cruft stays in Debian. It is a per package decision.
> Or, if you wish, continue to maintain it. All I'm saying is, don't
> delete packages still in active use.
This criteria is too simplistic.
> As I said, "they are converting to gnome-2 as soon as they can".
> Are you aware of the current level of gnucash development work? If
> not, then you are in no place to predict. As it happens, *I* am in
> touch with upstream and I *do* know the details.
I don't care how slow gnucash development is. If 10000 packages made
the switch from GNOME 1 to GNOME 2 _except_ gnucash, then to the hell
with it. You're saying I'm insensible with the gnucash developers and
their pace of development, why don't you simply say I'm the one putting
the knife under gnucash's throat and I can decide life or death of a
project?
> > Not only will you be Maintainer, but also upstream. It's hard to
> > measure how big and how many packages there are.
> It is not for you to declare what *other* people wish to maintain. If
> you do not or cannot maintain it any longer, then orphan it.
Ask yourself this: would people in the QA team have more time to
package RFPs if they didn't have to handle GNOME 1? Do you have any
measure for the usefulness of your time? And the QA team's time as a
whole? Of course, you do what you want with _your_ time, but shared
project resource are valuable, and my priority is our users as a whole,
not just the GNOME 1 users.
It's a big chunk of software, not some useful little things that you
keep to do users a favor, it needs real consideration before acting.
> > While it is generous for our users to offer your time to maintain old
> > software, I'm not sure you're really doing them a favor with respect to
> > bug fixes, and I'm not sure keeping so many old packages won't pressure
> > the release team and the security team: in the end, it also hurts
> > non-GNOME 1 users.
> This is nonsense. If you do not wish to maintain them, don't. Wash
> your hands of it. Be done! Orphan!
>
> STOP making me explain over and over to each gnome maintainer why they
> should STEP OUT OUT THE F*CKING WAY and either orphan a package or
> continue maintenance.
STOP SHOUTING, I ALREADY UNDERSTOOD I CAN ORPHAN PACKAGES, THANKS.
So I'm typing "nonsense", and I'm completely hysterically removing
packages. Well, the mad man in me gives you a strange look.
What about staying calm and having a polite conversation? Let's see if
it turns out to be sane to keep GNOME 1 longer, for example by
orphaning it (oh where did I get that idea about orphaning).
Do you have any list of GNOME 1 packages which might be completely
removed without hurting anyone? Do you have a list of packages
depending on some GNOME 1 packages? Do you have popcon statistics on
finance managers? Is it possible for users to export/import their data
from gnucash to other finance managers?
Bye,
--
Loïc Minier <lool@dooz.org>
<subliminal>Be constructive.</subliminal>
Reply to: