Re: booststrapping /usr-merged systems (was: Re: DEP 17: Improve support for directory aliasing in dpkg)
On Thu, 18 May 2023 at 07:39, Simon Richter <sjr@debian.org> wrote:
>
> Hi,
>
> On 5/18/23 02:15, Sam Hartman wrote:
>
> > Helmut> I think at this point, we have quite universal consensus
> > Helmut> about the goal of moving files to their canonical location
> > Helmut> (i.e. from / to /usr) as a solution to the aliasing problems
> > Helmut> while we do not have consensus on precisely how to do this
> > Helmut> (i.e. with changing dpkg or without). If you believe that
> > Helmut> this is not consensus, please speak up.
>
> > I agree we have strong consensus that we want to move files to their
> > canonical locations.
>
> > I'm not entirely sure I'd agree that we have consensus that's our
> > solution to the aliasing problem.
>
> It's the other way around: moving the files as a solution to the
> aliasing problem is the strongest argument in favour of moving the files
> inside the packages.
>
> Without it, leaving them in place makes no difference for usrmerged
> systems, and allows derived distributions that don't need usrmerge to
> continue using our packages.
Not quite. Having packages only ship files under /usr (and possibly
/etc) is very much a goal in itself for a lot of us.
> > If for example we accomplish the move to canonical locations by changing
> > dpkg, we might well get some form of aliasing support in dpkg.
>
> IMO, that is still the preferred solution:
>
> - it is actually safe, because dpkg knows what is going on and can
> reject conflicting changes
> - there is no guarantee that usrmerge will be permanent or the last
> transition of this kind
It is permanent, there are several upstream projects that will drop
support for legacy layouts very soon, and it will not be re-added
back. This will become more and more common, as simply most will stop
caring and paying any attention to this detail. Debian is pretty much
the last relevant holdout here, and that's going to end in a couple of
weeks.
> - it also solves the bootstrap problem
It also is the least likely to succeed, and the most likely to cause
significant "social" upheavals.
Kind regards,
Luca Boccassi
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