Re: Init systems and docker
Hello Tomas!
On 10/12/19 13:00, Tomas Pospisek wrote:
> I have to say that I disagree with you and many others on this thread.
> Maybe Docker was *meant* for single application containers, I do not know.
>
> However running a service ("a single application") often implies
> surrounding services. F.ex. you want logs to be saved? Maybe you need to
> run cron or at? Maybe you want to get notified about problems, stats,
> whatever via email?
In all the professional instances of containerization I have seen, these
are provided by external containers/services, so you don't have to
maintain several configuration in several places. Logs go to stdout and
from there you collect them into whatever service you have for this,
process them and use that processing to send notifications or make them
searchable.
>
> Now you can start re-implementing all the existing "surrounding" service
> solutions on the outside of the container. Which is a *lot* of complex
> work in my experience. The quick fix to those "surrounding" problems is
> often enough to stand onto proven-to-work shoulders and to install the
> "surrounding services" *inside* the container:
>
> apt-get install cron at rsyslogd etc. etc.
>
> Now the next problem is how to start those. Easiest way is to hook the
> provided Debian init scripts into whatever mini-init system one chooses.
> And so forth.
>
> So I imagine people that want to run stuff in containers are usually
> very glad if init scripts are available, work and can be re-used.
>
> John Goerzen is maintaining Debian docker images (thanks!) that contain
> a useful set of the mentioned "surrounding" services, that are quite
> popular AFAIK.
>
> Being you, I'd ask for patches. I think running stuff in
> Docker/Kubernetes is a good solution for a lot of problems. I think
> Debian should grow to accommodate those architectures. And I think
> Debian *will* accommodate them (see John's work and a lot of other nice
> efforts in that direction not least by Ubuntu), it just takes time to
> find the sweet spot solutions, to spread the knowledge and knowhow etc.
> A lot of container loads are Debian based, not the least a lot of
> Kubernetes' own people's
Debian already does for a part of container users. You don't need
patches, support is already there. The ones complaining right now
haven't read the right part in Docker's manual to get it running.
Cheers.
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