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Re: 2013 sometimes still feels like 2003 or 1993 (Re: NEW processing during freezes

+++ brian m. carlson [2013-05-03 21:39 +0000]:
> On Sat, May 04, 2013 at 12:10:25AM +0300, Timo Juhani Lindfors wrote:
> > "Bernhard R. Link" <brlink@debian.org> writes:
> > > Once we drop that and only give people the right to modify the
> > > software we distribute but no longer the possiblity to do so
> > > on their own, the "Free" we are so proud on gets mood.
> > 
> > Doesn't pbuilder make it easy enough for anyone to modify and build the
> > software on their own?
> The issue with sterile build environments is not just for building
> packages for normal use.  If I'm fixing a bug in a package, I may need
> to build that package several times, testing different fixes.  If
> everyone assumes that packages will be built in a sterile environment,
> nobody will care that their packages don't build twice in a row, 

This is a good point. I've been doing a lot of building of stuff 
(mostly the core/base ~200 packages) with small fixes recently and
it's clear that 'doesn't build a second time' is increasingly common
(and very annoying). This is a result of maintainer's workflows never
doing this, I presume. As Russ said - if it's not tested it probably
doesn't work.

I am huge fan of both building in clean environments _and_ being able
to build twice. I don't think there is any solution to this other than
testing it in an automated fashion. An sbuild or pbuilder option for
--build-twice would make testing a very simple matter.

Does policy say anything about this? Can it in fact be deemed FTBFS if
it fails the second time? I think it should.

Principal hats:  Linaro, Emdebian, Wookware, Balloonboard, ARM

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