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Re: Has Debian abandoned Python?

On Thu, Dec 03, 2009 at 04:48:37PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote:
> Steve Langasek wrote:
> > On Thu, Dec 03, 2009 at 02:11:41PM +0100, Frans Pop wrote:
> > The question of whether someone is doing an adequate job of maintaining a
> > package is a legitimate one.  The identity of their employer is
> > immaterial to an objective examination of this question.

> I think it *is* material in this instance:

No, because it's no longer an objective measure of whether the maintenance
of the package is adequate.  Your definition of "adequate" maintenance is
now based on how Debian is doing *compared to* Ubuntu, which is not a
standard that would be used anywhere else!

Python in Debian is currently in bad shape; on this, there is no
disagreement whatsoever.  But it's in bad shape by the measure that *it's
not meeting the needs of our users*, not because of where it stands relative
to Ubuntu.

If you don't believe this is true, then why are we having this discussion
about python, and not about:

 - the 6 patches to the pam package in Ubuntu that I haven't yet reviewed
   and pushed to Debian
 - each package ever uploaded to Ubuntu by a DD employed by Canonical that
   has not been ITPed for Debian
 - the fact that Debian is stuck with sysvinit as /sbin/init, whereas Ubuntu
   is running the event-based upstart which (modulo some growing pains) is
   simultaneously faster, more flexible, and more robust


The difference between these is simple:  one of these things - synchronizing
the Debian package with new upstream releases when deemed appropriate - is a
duty that one accepts responsibility for when agreeing to be maintainer of a
package in Debian; the others are not.  You may be *unhappy* about any or
all of these other things, but no one is calling for anyone to be forced out
as a maintainer as a result of them.  So Ubuntu is not the issue here.

And trying to make Ubuntu the issue is poisonous; it's shameful; and there's
no way that Debian comes out ahead.  When what should be a joyful experience
of Free Software collaboration becomes a zero-sum battle for "loyalties",
everyone loses.

Steve Langasek                   Give me a lever long enough and a Free OS
Debian Developer                   to set it on, and I can move the world.
Ubuntu Developer                                    http://www.debian.org/
slangasek@ubuntu.com                                     vorlon@debian.org

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