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Re: Override changes standard -> optional

> Is there any rationale from these internal discussions about why these tools
> have been demoted?  It's hard to refute an argument that hasn't been
> presented.

It was a discussion taking some time with us looking at the packages and
then seeing how many of us are in favour.

> The policy definition of 'standard' is:
>           These packages provide a reasonably small but not too limited
>           character-mode system.  This is what will be installed by default
>           if the user doesn't select anything else.  It doesn't include
>           many large applications.
> It's difficult to see how any of these packages fail the *definition* of
> standard.

Its difficult to see how any of these packages fulfill the *definition*
of standard.

The definition is wide enough to let us discuss without end.

>> strace
>> mtr-tiny
> I think these are useful troubleshooting tools that we ought to install by
> default.  mtr-tiny is the only traceroute tool included in standard
> currently.

I could buy that for mtr-tiny, but which average user can do anything
meaningful with strace so that it needs to be in standard? If you need
it you have bug, and the average user will report that $upstream
(debian, developer, wherever). And can then install it if asked to
strace something.

> For comparison, both of these packages are part of the Ubuntu standard
> system.

Thats not really convincing, we are in debian-devel after all :)

>> tcsh
> tcsh is still a commonly used login shell in some environments.

Some. Not really far. At least IME. Also, while it might be in use, does
it need standard? Its easy to install an extra shell. And the system
doesn't get unusable by it not being standard.

>> selinux-policy-default
> I think this needs to be at Priority: standard as a necessary step in
> SELinux bootstrapping, but I realize this is contentious.

There are lots of discussions around selinux, dont want to start yet
another, but the current status for Lenny doesn't let us feel like its
worth to have it in standard. This might be different for lenny+1 or +2.

>> finger
> It's been a while since I've seen a useful finger server, I think it's fine
> to drop this too.

db.debian.org, but that doesnt need it standard.

>> For the time right after the release we also intend to move ispell,
>> iamerican, ibritish, wamerian and dictionaries-common down.
> Why?  I don't think that's justified at all.

In that case I want igerman in standard too. Why should standard only have
english lists? Who wants spanish, japanese, whatever? Those are things
that should get installed by something like tasksel, depending on what
the admin selects for his environment.

bye, Joerg
A.D. 1492:
Christopher Columbus arrives in what he believes to be India, but
which RMS informs him is actually GNU/India.

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