Re: removal of svenl from the project

[Adeodato Simó <dato@net.com.org.es>]

* Andres Salomon [Tue, 14 Mar 2006 21:01:09 -0500]:

> Hi,

  Hi. FWIW:

> I am going through the expulsion process to have Sven Luther removed
> from the project.

  I've never worked closely with Sven Luther, but I've lurked in some
  teams he's member of, so if my capability as an observer is worth
  something to you, you may be interested in this if you're unfamiliar
  with Svenl. Over the time,

    - I've seem him repeteadly exhaust people's patience, both over
      important discussion, and over trivialities; which is, ok,
      something not so uncommon in this project, albeit undesirable.

    - I've seen him hijack technical discussions, making the possibility
      of a conclusion impossible due to him going over and over the same
      points in an unproductive fashion; which is, ook, something not
      so uncommon in this project, albeit very undesirable.

    - I've seen him several times reject good or even optimum solutions
      to problems, upon which a fair number of other people agreed, just
      for them going against his own personal agenda; which is, oook,
      something not so uncommon in this project, albeit very very
      undesirable.

    - BUT, I've also seen him, in uncountable occasions, steal the joy
      of hacking on Debian from many valuable developers of the project,
      make them frustrated and unhappy by continuously ignoring their
      request to be left alone, and make them less than willing to spend
      their time improving the technical quality of subsystems where
      Svenl was also involved. And this is something that, fortunately,
      one does not get to see everyday in the project, and something
      that has made me terribly sad whenever I've had to watch it.

  I haven't decided myself whether I think this procedure is too much
  for this particular case or not, and I'm aware that Svenl is not
  regarded as so nocive by many people who just see his good technical
  work and not him interact with others. But, if you want to listen, I
  do think Svenl has done much harm, if not to the project, to the
  _PEOPLE_ involved in some parts of the project, which is something
  that needs a solution. It's bad if your actions jeopardize a project's
  good name, or decrement its overall quality, but it's not bad but
  terrible when they go directly to contributors' feelings and amount of
  motivaion. Again, not sure still the proposed solution is the best.

  Also, just as a small anecdote: during the huge Vancouver thread, I
  mentally marked two people as having had a terribe and inexcusable
  behavior, and Svenl was one of them. While several people expressed
  their unhappiness or frustration very strongly, sometimes with nasty
  accusations or even insults, my mind could, while disagreeing to it,
  explain those reactions by putting them under a "caused by unbearable
  frustration" category; Svenl's behavior, otoh, surpassed the limits of
  my mind.

  Technical problems are hard, but we love them; social problems are
  harder, and we repeteadly ignore them until they explode.

-- 
Adeodato Simó                                     dato at net.com.org.es
Debian Developer                                  adeodato at debian.org
 
If you want the holes in your knowledge showing up try teaching someone.
                -- Alan Cox