Re: XFree 4.2.0 - again
Ack, I don't like doing this, but I'm provoked now...
<massive uncharacteristic flamage>
On Mon, 2002-04-15 at 23:30, Lasse Karkkainen wrote:
> Forgot to cc this to the list.. The message is attached.
> From: Lasse Karkkainen <email@example.com>
> To: Martin Pool <firstname.lastname@example.org>
> Subject: Re: XFree 4.2.0 - again
> Date: 16 Apr 2002 06:28:50 +0300
> > I think your case would be more convincing if you mentioned some
> > particular reason why Debian ought to upgrade. Presumably it supports
> > more cards or something. Having the current version is not super
> > important in and of itself.
> It's the hardware support. People are getting sick of VGA/VESA. I
> thought that it would be obvious.
I own some of the most recent/exotic video hardware out there, and it
works fine on Debian. I'd say there are less video cards that fail to
run on X 4.1 than there are video hardware Windows never has a chance of
supporting (read: big SGI coolness)
Hey, guest what, most of the odd drivers that *don't* work at 100% don't
work in 4.2 either, because the hardware companies didn't release specs.
If you have one of the 3 chipsets only supported in 4.2, there is
nothing stopping you from installing that. Except that you are instead
mucking around spouting ideas straight from your ass on a mailing list,
instead of learning how to do what you need to (i.e., build X).
> > I think Debian should put all its resources right at the moment into a
> > freeze first of all.
> So, Debian has a fixed number of developers, all working at 100%? I
> thought that it was fuzzy number of developers working when they feel
> like they are able and want to code (which is what free software is all
> about, IMO).
Yes, you are right. And Free Software should also have the advantage of
not having assholes shove their values down the developers' throats with
absolutely no contributions of their own.
Give me, and everyone else, one good reason why we should listen to your
ideas? Why we should get rid of a developer that made better X packages
than any other distro? Why Debian can't want a moment longer for X 4.2,
instead of letting the dumbasses flood the low-quality distros?
> > Nobody is stopping you building your own version of XF86 4.2 debs and
> > putting them up on a web page, or encouraging/paying other people to
> I guess you didn't read my original message: the problem is that I know
> next to nothing about Debian.
That's obvious. If you don't know anything about Debian, how in all the
fucking hells do you expect to be able to "encourage" developers to make
You do *NOT* understand a single goddamn thing you are talking about.
You know this. We know this. Why the hell can't you accept that? You
might as well try to tell a nuclear physicist how to do *his* job.
> > do so. Mere assertion that other people could do a better job than
> > Branden is not very persuasive.
> Maybe not *better* job, but they could do it *now* .. Also, if Branden
> is working on 4.1.0, why doesn't someone else do 4.2.0? Sounds like two
> separate projects to me.
Why the hell would we want a sub-par package in Debian? You said you
are willing to pay a developer to package X4.2... go ahead and do so.
That shitty package won't be in Debian, but you can use it.
Now isn't important. Stability is. I've used "now" based distros, and
guess what? They crash and lockup a *lot*. (that being once a week or
so, which is a lot for me.) You are fully free to use one of them
instead of Debian.
> What comes to encouraging other people - guess what I'm doing right now.
Encouraging them to what? Again, you have no idea what the hell you are
talking about, as you stated yourself. Learn what the hell you're
talking about *first*, then try to "help" the project.
Trust me, it doesn't work well doing those in reverse.
> > At reasonable rates, I would expect it to cost at least USD10000,
> > possibly a lot more, to build and test a reasonable combination of
> > platforms and systems.
> I believe "Unstable" (or even "Testing") is for testing and there surely
> are people willing to test it. Putting it together so that it runs on
> i386 really shouldn't be a big problem for any Debian developer.
Well, hey, guess what? You're wrong! Again, you don't know what you're
talking about. What you "believe" testing or unstable for is
irrelevant. If you want to know what they *are* for, it's clearly
documented on the Debian website, which it seems you have read much on.
Remove your head from your ass, go to the website, and try this thing
called learning for a bit.
> Other platforms aren't nearly as significant as i386 (not many users, no
> much new hardware).
I don't recall this being named Debian GNU/Linux x86. Debian is
multi-platform by nature. That's how it works. If you don't like it,
there are plenty of x86 only distros out there for you to annoy the hell
> > So what if he names you?
> Then I'll be spending lot of time in the local library, trying to learn
> how *nix/Debian work, and the release will take forever. Bad choice, really.
Here's an idea - learn how Linux and Debian work *before* you start
trying to make technical decisions regarding the packaging of X.
> > Surely this is a troll?
> Nope, I'm for real. Maybe a bit provocative, but for real.
And that is funniest part of it all. You're actually that clueless.
Since you seem to be too dense to understand any of the other replies
you've gotten, I'm not going to bother to try to clarify the technical
points made by the others. If your brain starts working properly, you
should be able to understand them yourself.
I subscribe to the tough love philosophy, and thought maybe if someone
made an effort to point you are a clueless moron who has no fucking idea
what he's talking about, you'd perhaps try to correct that severe
deficiency by learning, be it by reading books, the Debian website, or
the replies on this list.
> - Tronic -
</massive uncharacteristic flamage>
There, now that's out of my system, I can expect getting yelled at for
being an ass, more fucking retarded replies from Mr. Know-It-All
"Tronic" (how cute) himself, and otherwise being lowly thought of.
Good night. ^,^
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