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Re: Caldera installation - something Debian should learn



On Fri, 23 Apr 1999 tho@thomsen.isdn.cs.tu-berlin.de wrote:

> > > > I have read it. Keeping data in a text file that needs to be parsed
> > > > is an antiquated notion that needs to be eliminated. The information
> > > > contructs are correct, however.

Note: I have been corrected. The above solution could have an arbitrary
back end.

> > > no no no! keeping data in a text file may be an old notion, but is not
> > > antiquated and *definitely* does not need to be eliminated. quite the
> > > contrary, in fact. text files for configuration information are Very Good
> > > Things (tm) because *text files can be edited however one wants*. forcing

So can a database.

>  Right. This is the Unix spirit. Use a small orthogonal set of simple tools

"spirit"? Well if you have some sort of religous attachment to text files
then I can't convince you.

I think we should make the distinction here between *data* and a config
file. sendmail.cf is a language with variables in it(the data). 

> together to solve a given Problem. With text files I can grep through them
> or change them with sed on the fly. With binary config files, like on NT, I

With a database you can change the data with SQL or what have you.

> have to use the given tools. Either the problem is solvalble with them or
> you're doomed.

I would never say that windows * registries are the optimal solution.
They are the right idea, though, just a bad implementation.

> > In fact I believe that's their most glaring weakness. Enevitably popular
> > software has more and more parsers that read and write it's config files.
> > Note that they are DIFFERENT parsers(not equivalent ones). For any
> > dataset there should only be one way to access the data(one API for
> > example). This ensures that work is not duplicated. THIS is a good thing.
>  How many freeware/shareware/commercial registry editors exist for NT ?

I don't use NT too much. I'll bite: how many?

> > What about differential backups?
>  Yes, what's about them?

It should be ovious.

>  BTW: text files fit much easier in a version control system like CVS.

All good databases the same mechanism and better performance.
I believe cvs does binary files now as well.

> > > being able to edit the file. you can have some speed savings by building an
> > 
> > Who said you cannot dump the database to a text file?
>  Text files. The web-admin should be able to edit the config file(s) for the
> httpd, but not necessarily for the MTA. With many files you can exploit
> Unix file permissions for access control, with a central DB you have to
> invent some alternative scheme. And the past shows, that it's non-trivial
> to get security right.

Sure different databases, different permissions.

> PS: Look at SuSE's yast/rc.config for a warning.

Hmm. Don't have a SuSE box around here.


To sum up:
 Databases offer:
	better speed
	smaller size.
	other inhereted database properties
 text files have:
	the "advantage" that they can be edited easily
		consider: what if you're logging in remotely and they
			only have telnet or it's a slow connection?
	ppl are used to them
		this I think is the strongest point. Retraining
		is a major concern.
	they are not NT

Also note the difference bt _data_(uid=0) and a program(sendmail.cf).

+---------------------------------+-------------------------------------+
| R Garth Wood                    | Making waves...                     | 
| Stormix Technologies Inc.       |                                     | 
| rgwood@stormix.com              |                                     |


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