Re: Time for some Clarity (KDE, Qt, Open Source...)
On Mon, 29 Jun 1998, Kevin Atkinson wrote:
>
> I have a REAL problem with people who thing C++ is evil. It is not.
> C++ is a very powerful language and many many programs are beginning to
> be written it in. Including linuxconf...
>
That's not the point. I like C++ better myself, as do many people. The
point is that a C++ library is not nearly as useful on a Unix system,
because C is the standard. C and the Gtk+ object system also make bindings
to other languages relatively easy to implement.
> Well once GQt becomes stable would you then except KDE? I think that
> GNOME and KDE
> should work together rather than fight with each other.
Once FreeQt is done, KDE will be fine. But I expect Gnome to catch up to
KDE long before that happens. Reimplementing Qt is a long, boring job, and
none of the current KDE developers can work on it since they've seen the
Qt source (and they have said they aren't interested and don't see the
need). Gnome will happen much sooner. I don't expect FreeQt to be done
anytime soon.
> Similer but not what I had in mind. I want something more.
Implement more and Debian will probably be happy to accept the
contribution.
> But xf86config has some problems. Users should only have to identify
> there card and have it read from its database for everthing else, same
> with the moniter. This means that once the user enters in the card it
> should get the approperse server it needs.
Again, Debian wouldn't be opposed to this. But no one has created such a
database.
> > Debian as far as I know has no official goals relating to most of this.
> > It's more a matter of individual volunteers putting in the time and effort
> > to implement it, or not.
>
> Yes but some poeople like be have some fundemental diffrences.
>
Then stop posting to debian-devel and start your own Debian-based
distribution. Though I assure you that your differences probably aren't
worth reimplementing the Debian infrastructure.
> But in two are three years a lot of things can change.. Who knows what
> will happen.
>
All the more reason to do things the right way - open source endures and
adapts, and never becomes obsolete.
Also, I said one or two years, not two or three. And I'd say Gnome is
usable now. In one year it should be quite impressive.
> Why not. Once a GQt comes out then it can be used with debain. That is
> where I have a problem. KDE is a great system that is available now! It
> will become fully GPL is due time.
>
KDE is already on the Debian ftp server. Gnome is in main and will be as
good as KDE in a matter of months (in due time). You are advocating
throwing out the Social Contract (which would mean losing at least half
the developers, lots of credibility, and pissing off untold numbers of
people) in order to move a marginal short-term increase in Linux usability
from one directory on the ftp server to another.
Forgive us if we don't see the point.
> Just like the wine project which I fell will never get any where because
> it aims to emulate windows which is constantly changing, to fast for
> them to keep up...
>
Hmm, just like the FreeQt project.
> What I don't like the 101 distributions out there that distribute
> linux. I would like to see one coherend system that is easy to use but
> still has all the power that unix has.
>
Is that why you're wanting to start your own distribution rather than
working with Debian? Or do you believe in a unified system as long as
everything is done your way? Think about it.
Another key advantage of open source is that no one is opposed to it.
Plenty of people are opposed to non-open-source software. Thus a unified
standard for Linux must always be open source. This is another problem
with KDE.
> I really think that GMONE and KDE should put there diffrences aside and
> work together.
>
Yes, well, they are trying to be mutually compatible, but the projects
can't merge due to the Qt thing.
> I would also wish Debian and KDE should put there diffrences aside and
> work together.
>
KDE is packaged and on the ftp server. There's nothing else Debian can do
with respect to KDE.
Really, I don't know what you're advocating exactly. Debian is happy to
accept ease-of-use contributions. They aren't going to move KDE to main.
And that's it.
Havoc Pennington ==== http://pobox.com/~hp
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