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Re: Please let's not talk about "clouds"

On 22/04/13 at 09:56 -0700, Clint Byrum wrote:
> On 2013-04-21 23:16, Lucas Nussbaum wrote:
> >On 21/04/13 at 21:23 +0200, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote:
> >>On Sun, Apr 21, 2013 at 10:01:03PM +0900, Charles Plessy wrote:
> >>>One point that I think that is important to make, is that
> >>>points of view
> >>>diverge on the question of "software as a service", and that
> >>>the answer is
> >>>external to the foundation principles of Debian.
> >>FWIW, I disagree that the answer is external to the founding
> >>principles
> >>of Debian. In fact, I think this is one of the next big
> >>challenges ahead
> >>for both Debian and Free Software at large. As a project, we'll
> >>probably
> >>need to take an official stance on this at some point.
> >In the past, Debian has taken official stances on philosophical issues
> >only when they had technical consequences (GFDL, firmwares), e.g. on
> >the content of the archives or packages.
> >Do you think that we should go past that and make more general
> >philosophical/political statements, even if they have no effect on our
> >archive?
> >What kind of issues do you see that could require a project-wide
> >position? (I see one so far: packages that are clients to non-free
> >online services)
> I can see another that is related. The scenario is that, say, HP
> Cloud Services (my employer) were to put Debian images on their
> OpenStack cloud which is built on open source, but which does not
> have all of the code made available to users. The trademark policy
> is not clear on describing things which contain Debian itself. If
> HPCS adds a special super whiz-bang open source but HP cloud only
> thing to the images, its not clear that they can or cannot call that
> Debian still. It would be good for the project to make the policy on
> images clear at http://www.debian.org/trademark .

Right. Note, however, that this is not very different from HP shipping a
server with "Debian" pre-installed. So ideally, we would have a policy
that addresses both cases.

Does it sound doable that the requester would provide a script or
another complete description (e.g. Puppet/Chef) of the customizations
made from a standard Debian installation (either using d-i or


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