[Date Prev][Date Next] [Thread Prev][Thread Next] [Date Index] [Thread Index]

Re: new root and base disks available!

Paul Slootman wrote:

> On Tue 12 May 1998, Wes Bauske wrote:
> > Alexander Jolk wrote:
> >
> > > Loic Prylli <lprylli@graville.fdn.fr> writes:
> > >
> > > > Paul Slootman <paul@wau.mis.ah.nl> writes:
> > > > > Besides that, the kernel on the rescue disk I used didn't autodetect where I had
> > > > > connected the network on my multia (which was coax); luckily I had a
> > > >
> > > > That again is a problem of the kernel, and though we should address it
> > > > either by documentation (maybe a command-line option to the kernel can
> > > > help there) or by generating custom kernel, it is not linked to the
> Does the tulip driver accept any commandline parameters?

It does as a module.

> > Tulip.o does a much better job handling non-DEC Enet cards.
> > de4x5 basically works only on real DEC HW. If you use
> > de4x5, it won't work on my systems and lots of other people's.
> > Tulip is preferred by most people running 21x4x on Alpha,
> > particularly those using 100B-TX.
> > I believe most people using Linux Alpha are running on non-DEC
> > systems. Note MB is a DEC design but, it doesn't usually have
> > a built in Enet which leaves selection up to the buyer.
> That may be, but this was a rescue disk for the udb-noname, which only
> comes with the onboard network...

You mean it has no PCI slots to put a better Enet card in?? Prettysure UDB's have at least one slot

> offtopic: is it really true that most alpha's are non-dec? Here in the
> Netherlands most linux users with an alpha get it from one supplier, who
> only sells digital stuff at quite low prices (I think; my XLT-300 with
> 1GB disk, cdrom, matrox mystique, 96MB ram was about US$1250).

If you listen to the RH alpha list, you'll find almost all users either have164LX/164SX or the cheap
UDB boxes. There are a few oddballs too
but basically the UDB is getting less common. I honestly see no use
for any of the older DEC boxes. My Intel stuff will out-perform
them for most things. Only the 500MHZ+ are able to keep
significantly ahead of them. You can buy a 164SX MB/CPU for $800
here(USA) and build your own system for about the same price you
quote. Think a 533MHZ 164SX is quicker for the money. Of course
if you just like to be different, that OK by me.
I just want fast FP performance and all I look at are the high end models.
Really want to get a 21264... Should be the fastest workstation on the
planet when it gets here, at least for a few months.

> > Your comment that Tulip doesn't do selection as well as de4x5 is
> > incorrect. When you have to cope with a dozen different card designs,
> > the problem is much more difficult than a single manufacturer's
> > products. In general, tulip's weakness is due to the many varied
> > ways one can set up a 21x4x chip on it's programmable pins.
> > 16 ways for each chip set (21040/21140/21142/21143/etc.).
> > And, you have to hope the manufacturer put the correct
> > pin settings in the EEPROM! Quite a few don't.
> All the evidence I have is that the de4x5 does selection correctly,
> while the tulip doesn't. So, as far as I'm concerned, tulip does not do
> selection as well as de4x5 :-)

Read what I said above....Try a non-DEC Enet card with de4x5. High probability it won't
work. Last I heard, about 60% of all 100Mb Enet cards were
tulip based. DEC has sold lots of tulip chips to other vendors.
I can buy 100Mb-tx clone cards for $30.

If you want some insight as to how all this works, look at how each
DD setups up it's programmable pins. I read DEC's Tulip HW
reference to fix my non-MII cards in my PPro's. Also, get the tulip
DOS NIC programming kit if you want examples of how to set those

> You'd expect that digital had done the Right Thing; apparently not as
> far as the tulip driver is concerned.

Not really. Most of DEC's stuff are first generation designs.Almost all new tulip adapters use MII.
(Media Independent Interface)
That's the thing that talks to the wire (something called a PHYS chip).
I have one DEC 10Mb tulip card, a 21040 which I pulled out because
all I run are 100Mb-TX. Didn't bother to look at it since it's old/slow.
The old designs use the non-MII entries that describe each
possible type of connection. (10Mb/10MbFD/100Mb/100MbFD)
Also, some vendors used non-conforming entries in their EEPROMS.
By that I mean they ignored what DEC recommends in their HW
reference manual to put in the EEPROM. Tulip has to be modified
to handle each non-conforming adapter. If the adapter vendor follows
DEC's recommendations, it will work with tulip with no changes.
That means the DEC adapters don't follow their own standards.

> > If you use MII , tulip works great. When you have cards
> Please explain MII? This is the first I've heard of that...

It's all related to N-WAY auto negotiation. Most new hubs/switches use it to determine capabilities
of the other side of
the wire. Even the non-MII stuff does it with the help of the
tulip DD, but it works slick with MII cause the DD doesn't
care what's going on.Wes

To UNSUBSCRIBE, email to debian-alpha-request@lists.debian.org
with a subject of "unsubscribe". Trouble? Contact listmaster@lists.debian.org

Reply to: