Hello, On 2009 m. April 9 d., Thursday 17:46:44 Boyd Stephen Smith Jr. wrote: > >2) We will probably never forward a new upstream bug reported to the > > Debian BTS to KDE BTS (i.e. open a new bug) and we will not play proxy > > between the user and upstream. > > This is part of being a maintainer. If you aren't willing to do it, you > aren't being a very good maintainer. I think I can live with bad maintainer status then. What's good for small packages, may not work with big ones. > 3c) Make an impassioned plea to get others to do the job. Especially > others that *already* volunteered for that job. Heck, sometimes you make a > bigger impact campaigning for volunteers instead of trying to do it all > yourself. Campaigning is also work. Not everybody is good at compaigning. > Why do you think I don't understand the size of KDE? I do. I am a > developer by trade and I have adventured in the KDE svn repository in > search of the origin of a bug. My current job is porting millions of lines > of code in multiple languages from AIX to Linux. I'm not questioning your professionalism or experience. Just first try doing the job you are demanding others to do (i.e. dealing with Debian bug reports for all KDE packages). > No, it's not. I love the new packages in unstable. I've heard other had > problems upgradings (a few reports from friends and 2 on debian-user), but > it went smooth as silk for me. > > I absolutely do appreciate what they are doing. That doesn't make me > willing to let them shirk the responsibilities of a maintainer. By supervisoring others? Or asking for removal of KDE from Debian? Or what? You need to make compromises sometimes unless you are willing to do the work yourself. > I have the right to air my opinions. I don't have rank or authority in > Debian; I am just a user. Then better pick your words not to trash other people work next time. > If you aren't willing to follow the official documents why should anyone > else? > > If you want official documentation to change, there are established > procedures for that. You shouldn't ignore them or change them by fiat just > because they don't serve your purposes right now. That's the reason those upstream bugs are not closed as soon as they arrive at Debian BTS. But they rot there making BTS hard to find real issues which we could solve. > How is a non-technical Debian user supposed to know if a bug is Debian- > specific or not without installing a different distribution? They know > they got the software from Debian and it is broken, they should be able to > file their bug with Debian. Maintainers should be prepared to forward a > bug if need be. Ask on generic kde forum, on generic kde irc channel or somewhere else first. I'm also talking about OBVIOUS upstream bugs. Btw, Debian ships as much unpatched vanilla KDE as possible. We do not backport features or even fixes for annyoing bugs from KDE trunk or random 3rd party patches. > Won't someone please think of the users? The reason I'm talking with you is because I think of the users. The reason we try hard to maintain and publish _good_ packages is because we think of the users. The reason KDE is in Debian is because Debian KDE maintainers think of the users. Heck, the reason Debian exists is because Debian developers think of the users. Sure, "users" include developers themselves, but also all other people who find Debian usable regardless of (a few) deficiences. -- Modestas Vainius <modestas@vainius.eu>
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