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Re: Some thoughts regarding DW

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Am 15.08.2005 um 04:04 schrieb Hanna M. Wallach:

Debian Women is well placed to make a significant
contribution to the wider free software community.

Thank you for clarification.

I think, Debian-Women is really not the right place for me.

Let me give an example here, what i miss in Debian-Women:

Clear goals and discussion about them
Trying to discuss milestones to reach these goals

Beside that there are other things, I cannot handle with:

No acceptance if it is critisized, that changes in the web site are not tested thoroughly before putting them online Making decisions behind the scenes in an IRC-Channel or just only by private mail exchange excluding others [1] Handling issues with arguments: like "install unstable" (if something is not available for your system) Handling accessibilty issuse related to the web pages due to not keeping web standards with arguments like "lynx is buggy, use links" - - - we like it as it is.

The last one was one thing, that hurt me extremly, even if I for myself can use graphical browsers. But there are people that have to rely on lynx.

That out of the three subject in my mail only two are covered and not the second one seems to be symptomatic for d-w.

Let me ask some question relatet to 2. subject of my former mail:

- - - How will d-w handle women, who are just users and search for support do learn more about their Debian-System? - - - Will the activities of the d-w members stick to forcing d-w in the future as main goal? [2] - - - How will d-w handle problems, when women feel they are threatened by sexists inside debian-project? Will there be a place they can go to without meetings men mostly? - - - In all the users groups, channels you see about much less then 5% real women (not only having female nick). So, assuming d-w will not work on getting more female users, how does the project want to increase the number of female developers? - - - Who is Debian-Women? Who makes the decisions? Women only? Project Leader (which is not a DD, but the project is a Debian project)? Core members (who are those)? Random people in #debian-women? Everyone at his/her own, but some are not allowed? - - - How will d-w (like other parts of Debian do) respect that not all people can express their thoughts as good in english as native speakers can do?

I hesitated a lon time to try to get more clarification about the goals and habit of/inside d-w. But that it was at least not possible to find a solution for the dicts, which were not made up for my personal fun but wanted by d-w people and the reaction against clythie forced me to write that mail now. Hope people from outside see it as it is: critics against the d-w project and not against Debian as a whole.

I could express all this quite much better in my mothers tongue. But as it is an international mailing list I use english as everyone, not knowing, if I found always the right words.



[1] Here a citation of a public mail which forces this behaviour:

[...] please toss comments in
my direction before I do this. (Off-list email is fine if people are
concerned about staying on-topic or don't wish to get into long discussions about which is better in general. I'm just looking for impartial advice.) [...]

There are some more messages about discussing other things offlist. That might not be bad at all, if things are discussed later in the list all. But in fact, it isn't very often. Debian is a community project and would have been dead already, if it wasn't. I D-W becomes a mostly closed group to other opinions and decisions are made only by the project leader, it will die some day of just bubble along. The success of d-w cannot only be measured by the counter how often it is mentioned in press and weblogs.

[2] Everyone may make their own picture of what d-w members are doing/ have done inside Debian Project beside trying d-w itself. It is not an accident that this question was sucbject in the discussions on Debconf.

- - --http://www.witch.westfalen.de

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