Re: No goals, selective memory, be nice, red nose day
MJ Ray wrote:
Carla Schroder wrote:
I shouldn't feed the troll, but what the heck. So here's how it goes:
Likewise, I'm sure.
adopting a role of a troll will only make you a target.
one of the reason this list exists is because trolls target minorities.
it takes a long time for minorities to gain respect in the wider community,
especially when trolls make waves and take chunks out of people for no
1. You don't support Debian-Women
2. You disagree with our goals, and don't think we should even exist
"Our goals"?!? Collectively, you still have no stated goals! How can I
disagree with them or support them? It turns out there is practically
nothing to support or disagree with.
if you are so interested in this community, you may have read all the archives,
and if you have done so, you would have noticed that this community is fairly new.
creating a set of goals takes time. there has been discussion about the goals
of the community, on and off list. as you appear not to be subscrided, you may
have missed these.
This is part of the problem with discussing whether or not a
debian-women list should exist. When I tried to research, explain and
form conclusions, I got flamed to a well-done crisp because it's not the
way it looked, or so I'm told.
see troll comment. theres been discussion about feeding trolls. sometimes
there can be an overreaction.
3. You come only to whine, nitpick, complain, and criticize, and never
ever ever do even a single constructive act
You are simply ignoring constructive acts. I have tried to reply
usefully to RFCs and questions. I have no interest in constructing a
segregated space, so it shouldn't be surprising I don't act towards that.
there are reasons that women may want to create a segragated space.
must you insist on being one of them?
For comparison, what constructive acts are you doing on-list? Last week,
you come only to greet, flame, AOL and post URLs, AFAICT.
4. But you still want people to be nice to you, and treat you well,
and accept you as a member of the community. Which you are very clear
you disapprove of, and do not support
Well, even if so, why not? This list claims friendliness and intolerance
of bigotry, yet it's ferpectly pine for anyone not praising debian-women
to be attacked by listers with flames, abuse, public IRC logs or
conspiracies of silence. Such behaviour will get no rebukes here.
see the comments about feeding the trolls.
I never did count you as a supporter, just a prime example of why
groups like Debian-Women are needed. Though this is approaching comic
The next comic relief/red nose day is 11 March 2005, so I guess it's
I am a prime example why groups like debian-women work against their
aim: I believe in equal opportunities in debian for all, regardless of
irrelevant characteristics like sex. I don't even know whether there are
any women amongst those I collaborate with on packaging, for example
(because I don't know some of the people well enough yet and it's not
that important). In future, I will try to avoid many of the posters to
this list on some things. I guess it helps that me to know who you are:
a purpose for debian-women!
i believe you have misunderstand the purpose of this community.
The idea of parts of the debian project being closed to a particular sex
or race is offensive to me, yet some debian-women participants support
similar moves in other projects or call things like linuxchix "a great
community". The solution to running into a wall is to knock it down, not
build your own! The other likely offensive move is promoting the idea
that "friendly," "welcoming" and similar notions are essentially linked
with "women". Thank you carla for tirelessly working to kill that myth. ;-)
i do not believe that the debian-women project is closed, open only to
this project is here to help women in the large community that is debian.
there are men here too. if either of these ideas are too hard to contemplate
then perhaps you should pull your head in and contentrate on something else instead.
I am not subscribed and I request a cc, although I fully expect carla to
ignore the request yet again. I don't set Mail-Followup-To because djb's
proposal is buggy. (On broken email clients, when is mutt getting
its funny how those who are most pedantic about mail standards are often the least
agreeable people ;)