On Friday, March 29, 2013 09:41:23, Stefano Zacchiroli wrote: > On Thu, Mar 28, 2013 at 05:37:18PM -0400, Chris Knadle wrote: > > Technically the DAM has the ability to act to remove a DD (per Debian > > Constitution 8.1 item 2), but the information I can gather so far seems > > to indicate that the DAM won't expell a DD for disciplanary problems. > > FWIW, that is not correct. There have been other cases of member > expulsions for, as you put it, "disciplinary" reasons, but for various > good reasons not all of them are discussed publicly --- one thing is > expelling a developer, another is putting that up to ever lasting public > shaming on the web. DAM can and do expel for disciplinary reasons, > either on their own initiative, or following up to initiatives by other > project members. Whether that is done "enough" or not, of course, is a > separate matter. That's fair enough, but it would likewise be incorrect to make /assumptions/ about things I know nothing about. As such, there's an issue of "public perception" that may need consideration. If publicly a DD consistently misbehaves and seems to get away with it for a long time, but is later quitely and privately expelled, the public perception that remains is "Debian seemed to do nothing about it". Additionally this effectgively censors things such that the issue can only be discussed in the general sense; e.g. "more DDs have been expelled than you are aware of", which is not useful information -- it leaves out all of the reasoning behind what a DD could theoretically be expelled for and what constitutes "going too far". I simultaneously acknowledge the problem of making a "DD expulsion list" public; that's not exactly the kind of "trophy" anyone would want to obtain. > > That might be one explanation for the steady drop in new bug reports: > > That's a bit preposterous, imho, the huge popularity of some of our > derivatives---which, in the general case, both benefits from our work > and give back to us so that we benefit from theirs---is a much more > simpler explanation of those numbers. Beware of simplistic explanation. I'm open to other theories as to the cause. I am, however, a bit surprised that you'd completely dismiss the theory I've proposed so quickly. I'll just let you know that I regularly bump into users in Debian IRC channels saying things such as "I need to be involved in another bug report like I need a hole in the head." I take that as a clear signal that there's a problem. As always, I thank you for your comments. :) -- Chris -- Chris Knadle Chris.Knadle@coredump.us
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