Re: drop or keep non-free - from users viewpoint
On Tue, 09 Mar 2004 20:10:13 +0100, Sven Luther wrote:
> Well, spim may be an exception, but as soon as you speak about
> libraries, and different versions from different sources of those, you
> are starting to do into the .rpm dependency hell problem.
yes, but i think the most things in non-free are user-programs,
documentations and binary drivers. And this are things which have not a
great impact of the stability of a system whether they come from a .deb
.rpm or .tar.gz
>> Yes the installation system of sarge will definitely an improvement. But
>> main package still recommend or suggest non-free package which is some
>> kind of advertising and promoting of non-free software.
>
> And ? Where is this problem. We claim that we will not make base
> dependent on non-free item, not that we will totally ignore those. Also,
> it is quite hidden info, and a casual user will never even notice those
> probably.
i think this "advertising" will see at least everyone who install his
programs with apt-get.
Is it a problem? For you maybe not. For other it may be a problem.
But i think it is a fact that on this way Debian promote non-free programs
and may lead people to use non-free program (for more details see my first
mail)
>> If i talk from the homepage i don't mean something like advertising
>> banners or something like this. But for example, if a user search in the
>
> Well, you speak about the homepage, and this mean the actual home page,
> and the text you can read on it. What you seem to imply is the full
> content of the web site, and especially those stuff which is well hidden
> from casual observation.
ok, maybe i could have explain it more correctly. For me "homepage" was a
synonym with "services which were offered through www.debian.org".
But i think there are many users who uses this package database and if i
search a mp3 player and don't think a lot about free vs. non-free this
search can lead me to non-free software even if there would have been a
free program for my needs. And i think Debian should lead there users to
Free Software and not to non-free Software. Also i think if you see all
these points, it's hard to explain the user that non-free isn't part of
the Debian OS as i have already wrote in my first mail.
>> not more than now. If its is no more part of Debian than main package will
>> not suggest or recommend these packages and you will not find them in the
>> package database on the Debian homepage.
>
> And i seriously believe that removing recomends and suggests will be a
> bad thing. If this is indeed the case, it is indeed one more reason not
> to drop non-free, thanks for bringing it to my attention.
I don't think recommends an suggests should be removed at all, but Debian
main packages shouldn't recommend or suggest non-free packages, if
non-free is really not part of the Debain OS than i think the Debian OS
shouldn't recommend or suggest these software.
> Except by being maintained by the exact same set of debian developers.
Yes, but maybe also from some people who are not Debian Developers?
But this work from this people would have nothing to do with Debian. This
would be activities from Debian Developers beside there activities as DD
and not as part as there job as DD.
Cheers,
Markus
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